intel Core2 Duo & 64 bit

[treehouse786]

Originally Posted by Bill_Bright

and sometimes (usually dependent on the graphics solution) just 2.8Gb of the full 4Gb installed. This is due to the way the 32-bit OS maps the upper memory.

thanks for pointing this out, not many people know this.

[Bill_Bright]

Originally Posted by SirDrexl

The only hardware that matters WRT 32- or 64-bit is the CPU. Provided, of course, that 64-bit drivers are available for things like add-in cards, printers, and misc. devices.

Sorry, but it is not nearly that simple.

ALL the hardware matters - not just the CPU, cards, printers, or other misc devices.

As pointed out, 64-bit drivers for the motherboard's chipset are essential. But there are MANY more devices on the motherboard itself that matter too. The disk drive controllers, integrated sound device, USB and Firewire controllers.

In effect, ANY device that requires a driver will need a 64-bit driver.

The reality is the vast majority of CPUs have been 64-bit ready for many years - typically much longer than just about everything else!

[AaLF]

Hey Bill,

Will upgrading to Win7 64bit require a graphics card or only to enable games & does x64 put extra load on the power supply?

[Bill_Bright]

Will upgrading to Win7 64bit require a graphics card or only to enable games & does x64 put extra load on the power supply?

Sorry, but I don't understand what you are asking

The fact a computer is running 64-bit or 32-bit has nothing to do with the power supply. I take that back, but only by a tiny bit. 64-bit supports more RAM. But that is very little to graphics card requirements. That is, lots of RAM takes more power to run, but not enough to worry about. If unsure, plug all your hardware into the eXtreme PSU Calculator Lite and see what you need. I generally recommend setting Capacitor Aging to 10% and setting both TDP and system load to 100%. These steps ensure the recommended supply has adequate head room for stress free (and perhaps quieter) operation, as well as future hardware demands. Setting Capacitor Aging to 30% will provide an even nicer amount of headroom.

Upgrading to 64-bit, first and foremost, requires 64-bit drivers for all your hardware devices. All the devices integrated into the motherboard, and any add-on device like graphics cards. So you MUST ensure you have drivers. If your hardware is less than 3 years old, I cannot imagine 64-bit drivers not being available. Printing devices are often a problem because people hold on to old ones and the makers may not have 64-bit drivers for them.

The vast majority of programs designed to operate in 32-bit Windows XP will run fine in 64-bit Windows 7 and without needing to run in virtual XP mode (available in some versions of W7). IMO, if a software maker has failed to keep up with the times by providing 64-bit ready Windows 7 capable updates, it is time to find a different program. Windows 7 came out 3 years ago this month and the 64-bit version is, by far, the most widely used.

[AaLF]

Seems I'm running out of excuses for avoiding Win7. Maybe this will hold off the inevitible:

Question: My MBd etc are confirmed 64bit capable. But will I survive on 2Gb of RAM until I get around to buying some or will life be uncomfortable from the moment Win7 opens its eyes??

[roger_m]

Originally Posted by AaLF

Seems I'm running out of excuses for avoiding Win7. Maybe this will hold off the inevitible:

Question: My MBd etc are confirmed 64bit capable. But will I survive on 2Gb of RAM until I get around to buying some or will life be uncomfortable from the moment Win7 opens its eyes??

I'm running 64 bit Win 7 with 2 gigs of RAM, and it's perfectly usable. I do plan on adding more RAM as sometimes my memory use exceeds 80%. However I often have multiple programs open and 10 to 20 tabs open in my web browser so the high memory use is understandable.

[NormanF]

MS says you can't upgrade from Windows XP to Windows 7.

This is incorrect - you can do this with a third party tool that preserves ALL the data and allows you to restore it to the new operating system when the upgrade is complete.

[Bill_Bright]

MS says you can't upgrade from Windows XP to Windows 7.

This is incorrect - you can do this with a third party tool that preserves ALL the data and allows you to restore it to the new operating system when the upgrade is complete.

They are correct in that there is no direct upgrade path from XP to Windows 7. And while there are 3rd party applications, they don't have a stellar reputation.

The OS is the most important program (or a bunch of programs) on your computer. It is coordinates and facilitates all communications, protocols, and handshaking between all the hardware components, and software components on your computer.

Frankly, when installing operating systems, a fresh install on a newly formated disk is the best way to ensure the most trouble free operation and sure to leave your hard drive much less cluttered with useless, old OS files.

[AaLF]

Originally Posted by nosirrah

http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...id=2669#driver

There is a 7 64 option for his mother board but it looks like the chipset driver is not there. That's easy to pick directly up from intel though:

http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Deta...adType=Drivers

There is no mention of onboard gfx driver but since you are using an add-in card (which is modern so 7 64 is fully supported) that should not matter.

In the absolute worst case there may be an odd device or two that does not automatically pick up a driver either through this process or on your first trip to windows updates but even then its an easy fix. You can go to device manager and pick up the device IDs for anything that does not get a driver and then look it up online.

Just a FYI, MS does give this board the 7 64 thumbs up:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/com...r%20Components

Just confirming - is this all the drivers I need for win7x64? not many. Do some drivers come with win7 CD?

[nosirrah]

"Just confirming - is this all the drivers I need for win7x64? not many. Do some drivers come with win7 CD?"

Between the network driver from the site, the GFX driver that will come with new GFX card, the intel update utility, what comes on the 7 disk and what you can get on your first trip to windows updates you should have most it not all drivers setup. The network driver will allow you to get any ones you missed taken care of one way or another. If there are any missing in device manager after you set this up we can help you find the rest.

[Sir paranoids]

Bill_Bright:
Sorry, but that is incorrect.

While it is true with only 2Gb of RAM, you will not be able to take advantage of 64-bit's potentials, there is no disadvantage in running 64-bit with less than 4Gb. And in fact, contrary to the above comment about 4Gb, with 64-bit you can take advantage of the full 4Gb, but not with a 32-bit OS. If you install 32-bit, the most RAM you will be able to utilize will be less than 3.6Gb, typically only about 3.2Gb, and sometimes (usually dependent on the graphics solution) just 2.8Gb of the full 4Gb installed. This is due to the way the 32-bit OS maps the upper memory.

So with 4Gb installed, there IS indeed a need to install 64-bit if you want to fully utilize your RAM's potential.

Also, if you install 32-bit with just 2Gb installed, what happens if you later on want to bump up your RAM? You will be restricted and there is no easy "upgrade path" from 32-bit to 64-bit either. Therefore, it makes no sense to install 32-bit today - if 64-bit drivers are available for your hardware.

32-bit is ancient history. It needs to go away so development resources can concentrate on a single platform, the 64-bit platform - the most popular purchase with and installed on new computers today.

Installing a 32-bit OS greatly limits expansion potentials. Since they cost the same, there is no reason not to go 64-bit and many reasons to go with 64-bit. It is time to move forward, not hang on to the past.

no disrespect but "Sorry, but that is incorrect" lol


multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /3GB /PAE /noexecute=optin /fastdetect

8 gigs ram for winxp ^^ yaha

Certain 32-bit versions of Windows Server running on x86-based systems can use PAE to access up to 64 GB or 128 GB of physical memory
.source~ micro $oft

some 32bit Os setups can go way past this as well though its a funky topic.

trick is to edit the boot.ini file in your root dir of where it is you installed windows

more info on the PAE Switch PAE link

BTW beware older apps don't like this trick at times.

id all so enable full DEP for this kind of setup.

[nosirrah]

PAE only makes more address space available, windows XP is hard coded to use 4 gigs - reserved for hardware.

It would be like me giving you $1000 but putting it on the moon. Sure its yours but there is no way you can use it.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r275...even-with-PAE-

In general you can google 'does PAE work on XP' and you will find endless info about it not working.

EDIT:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr.../gg487503.aspx

[Sir paranoids]

funny i tested it and i can detect more then 4 gigs ram being used though windows douse a good job at hiding the extra ram and it needs to in a way.

and yes your right the Os can not use more then 4 gigs at any given time or 2 gigs if i remember right "maybe 3" for any given program but the extra ram is still their and can still be used in some cases.

btw windows 2003 server "winxp server" is a 32bit os that supports 128gigs ram if you understand how that works ^^ kind of funky in a way

really all its good for is when you start adding in big video cards with lots of ram.
so if you had 4 gigs system ram + 1 gig page file + 1.5 gigs ram on the video card you end up with
total ram {1.5+1+4=6.5 gigs total}

you know the only software that i found that can detect that the ram is even being used is .

EVEREST Ultimate Edition v5.50

if you want i can get off my butt and make a SS for ya of the extra ram being detected :O)

plz keep in mind that in winxp the os will try and hide the fact that the ram is being used and is their, that's probably why most of the posts out their on the topic people think it just doesn't work but it douse, you can feel it in some ways and really on some levels its better and faster and on other it really just slows things down and makes the os buggy when trying to use older apps.

wiki:
x86 processor hardware-architecture is augmented with additional address lines used to select the additional memory, so physical address size increases from 32 bits to 36 bits. This, theoretically, increases maximum physical memory size from 4 GB to 64 GB - although the actual amount increased depends on the OS. The 32-bit size of the virtual address is not changed, so regular application software continues to use instructions with 32-bit addresses and (in a flat memory model) is limited to 4 gigabytes of virtual address space. The operating system uses page tables to map this 4-GB address space into the 64 GB of physical memory. The mapping is typically applied differently for each process. In this way, the extra memory is useful even though no single regular application can access it all simultaneously.

[nosirrah]

the extra ram is still their and can still be used in some cases.

Yes, you can map the extra ram to a ramdisk and then mount it, this is the loophole. You can then move certain disk functions to this space to get a speed boost.

btw windows 2003 server "winxp server" is a 32bit os that supports 128gigs ram if you understand how that works ^^ kind of funky in a way

Yes, that is what the chart says. The server version has different memory management functions than XP does. The desktop OS and server version are not 1:1.

if you want i can get off my butt and make a SS for ya of the extra ram being detected :O)

I can do the same with my 8 gigs in XP being detected (in many apps BTW) but in memory management it clearly still shows less than 4 available. I use the extra 4 as a ramdisk.

[nosirrah]

Here is the ram breakdown on this system.

[Sir paranoids]

your running winxp 32 on a i7 , nice

didn't know about the ram drive trick,interesting and ya its more or less the same deal in a lot of ways with PAE, the /3 switch gives the os 1 gig ram for its use and 3 gigs for the Os and the PAE like your setup is more or less a overflow ram drive.

man i wouldn't want to see what a Os is like with 64gigs ram that mean the os in question would have 64/4 = 32 memory banks, retarded.

the Os would be shuffling data from one bank to the other all day long and that would slow the Os down in a big way.
its all most faster at that point to get the needed data from a hdd at that point vs 75% of your cpu core just doing memory swap action and its not like the os in question can run any one app in any case that needs more then 3 gigs or ram kind of deal.

for winxp PAE is like ultra expanded memory in a way, the 4 basic lower range memory areas being Expanded~extended~high memory~Conventional memory range if i remember right.

to tell you the truth more often then not i dont even use the PAE trick,it really tends to freak some programs out and or just makes em run like garbage.
i remember one game that really didn't like it.
think it was called duke nukem openGL 3d or something, it would go for the highest memory range it could and windows would go in to memory swap over drive = fps lag lag lag crunch crunch ~ shutter shutter shutter just freaking lame lol

time for some pics

http://oi45.tinypic.com/2dv21u.jpg

http://oi49.tinypic.com/2cxstnl.jpg

for the record i have with this test setup 4 gigs system ram 512ram on the video card and 1 gig swap file.

odd numbers on the pics done you find its like the benchmarking and dignotic app gets confused by the use of PAE ,i know its running though when im setup in PAE , the computer doesn't handle the same way, i can feel it doing the memory swaps from the twin banks.

lol god XP runs fast as F$%^ on a 4000+ mhz core 2 setup, its like inhuman fast and i don't think you can click that fast hehe.

[nosirrah]

your running winxp 32 on a i7 , nice

Its dual boot XP32 + 7 64 pro.

Install 1 gig of ram and then set your page file to 8 gigs and take another pick showing virtual memory. Virtual memory can break the 4 gig cap but it does not change how much physical memory XP will use. You can create a ramdisk in the inaccessible area and then move your page file there, this will get you around the OS limit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_memory

[Sir paranoids]

Cant seem to push the page file past 4096 Kb it would seem on a computer even with 1gig ram ,don't know what that's all about.


hay i was thinking seeing as win server 2003 can support 64 gigs ram in none uniform architecture memory computing setup, do you think theirs a way some way of robbing win server 2003 of a feu *.dll files or something to mod out winxp for more memory support ?
hemm its a sham we can't just swap out emm.386 and maybe a feu mods in the autoexec.bat like the old days but i guess its not that simple anymore.

64/4 = 32 memory banks, retarded.

ps err i meant 16 banks looks like im the retard