No offense?! Yes, really!!

[LowWaterMark]

Have you ever noticed how easy it is to offend someone else online?

Sometimes you are posting along having a great day and suddenly, out of no where, you get a reply to a post that tells you quite bluntly that you've just insulted another person. A short time later the thread has gone off-track and people are flaming each other, and then in steps a Moderator who ends up closing the thread and everyone is angry - mostly at you.

Or, perhaps you've been on the other side on this situation. There you are trying to be helpful, posting your heart out when suddenly, for no apparent reason, someone makes a reply that appears to be down right rude and offensive, and it is aimed directly at you.

If you haven't seen this or been involved in at least one of these situations yourself, then you probably haven't been posting very long, or perhaps you aren't posting in any controversial topics or places.

I'm bringing this up for a couple reasons...

First, to remind everyone that it is very easy to misunderstand what someone intends to say in a written post. It is much harder to be clearly and consistently understood in just a few written sentences then it is when you are speaking with someone face to face.

Second, we all need to remember that the Internet spans around the world, and International Forums such as Wilders Security have quite a diverse group of participants. While Wilders is mostly an English language forum, (the main exception being the LnS French forum section), over half the people here do not have English as their primary language.

Think about that and its implications. Try to imagine just how much translating is being done here and how people of different languages, cultures and backgrounds can so easily misunderstand what is written in a post. Imagine times when even a simple joke, which would be funny to people with similar backgrounds, causes insult to someone who has a completely different frame of reference.

We all need to be mindful of this and try to use extra care in writing our posts, while also giving the benefit of the doubt to others, when reading what has been posted. It's best not to assume an insult and react to it when what was intended could be totally innocent.

Of course, there really are people who simply intend to insult others and disrupt a forum. Their only purpose being to cause trouble and attempt to insight flame wars. Sometimes they post inflammatory remarks against individuals, or certain vendors or products, just so they can get other people to post flaming comments back at them. (We usually refer to these people as Trolls. Hence the expression "Please don't feed the trolls." )

Remember, there really is no good reason, nor any benefit to you or your overall well being, to take offense from things that are written online. If we all use a little care in choosing how we word our posts, and if we are generous in how we interpret what others post, then we'll all have a lot more fun (and a lot less stress) online.

[Tinribs]

A good post LWM, I guess its easy to forget that the internet is a multi national experience, I know I've been guilty of reading a response wrong and had my posts read wrong also.

I guess we all need to be a bit more understanding and think twice before responding.


Kev

[JimIT]

quoting: Tinribs link=board=27;threadid=11108;start=0#msg72270 date=1057674928]
A good post LWM, I guess its easy to forget that the internet is a multi national experience, I know I've been guilty of reading a response wrong and had my posts read wrong also.

I guess we all need to be a bit more understanding and think twice before responding.


Kev

I agree w/TR!

Great post, LWM. Everyone needs a reminder now and then--I know I do!

[Detox]

hear,hear!

I've had similar problems with a few of my online gaming friends even - most are dutch and a few of them aren't as good at english as others and we've had such misunderstandings in the past... They never got outta hand tho cause we figured out the cause :-)

I wrote this cause my example shows how easy it can be to happen - and this is with guys I was teammates with in competitions...

[Mr.Blaze]

yup i do that all the time its my short edgucation as will as proper edicet and manners and the fact that im blunt and truthful

i have some cyber canadian frinds that find my bluntness and truthfullness apalling.

so my huemor and my behavior isnt understood that well in most other countrys lol so i end up hurting peoples feeling untill they figure out oh thats just blaze being laze.

only after awhile do they get use to me lol and just accept me as who i am.

ive even goten off on the wrong foot here at wilders quiet a few times.

but in the nd it works out

you know not all countrys are rude and vulger and blunt as ours many americans joke around with frinds with playful insults other countrys cant grasp that type of behavior

for example i can hit my frind on the shoulder and insult everything from clothing to his mother and it never be taken personaly he would do the same to me.

do that to some one from other country and you most likely would end up kissing the floor lol

so you always have to be more concidreit with others

its best to use proper table manners and fancy behavior when talking to people from other countrys then gradgualy let your self out by then your good enough frinds that he know you well enough to kid around with

but in some countrys it just better to stay proper with them all the time lol

[Uguel707]

From Watermark:

If we all use a little care in choosing how we word our posts, and if we are generous in how we interpret what others post, then we'll all have a lot more fun (and a lot less stress) online.

Right! We're supposed to be here to help, it isn't helpful picking each other.

I was at another forum (born language) before coming here. I stopped going there for people were insulting each other, too often, and they were very hard and arrogant with the newbies. Most of the 5-star-people wouldn't care talking to a newbie most of the time anw.
They would rather talk to "the graduated ones" Newbies were confined to the dark. :'( So there was no point in going there anymore eh?

Of course, I found another forum in my own language, but all people ask questions and seldom did they answer.
Most of them are newbies! So, I decided to come here after someone had referred "The Wilders" in the arrogant forum. At least I had one good info from them!
That person gave the address to a newbie who wasn't able to get any answer, I grabbed the address too!

From time to time, I go in the "newbie" forum (but stopped going to the "arrogant" one) for I can help people when they ask questions I can answer. Sometimes, I even came here to ask questions in their names. I share what I learn here.

So, let's keep it pleasant instead!

from Blaze:

i have some cyber canadian frinds that find my bluntness and truthfullness apalling.

Like Uguel for instance?

Well, you often have very good points and dare saying what most of us wouldn't but would like to. I remember the topic when you talked about all security programs your have installed for protecting your computer (whereas other people were talking "very seriously")

You said all of those cost you 0¢.

That was both funny and smart!

Uguel

Also, even if we don't agree with someone, there is no reason to be hard on him/her. Diversity open the door to better knowledge, better understanding. We always have the choice to take what suits us and put aside what isn't helpful for our needs. If a person is really wrong, he/she needs help and no contempt.

[Mr.Blaze]

yeah but thats true if you ask around alot of the guys have played with every application out there includeing freeware

if you ask they have some great info on free stuff that most usealy never hear of.

jan and lowwater have pointed me in the direction of many free applications.

i think here every one gets treatead equaly

what makes wilders great is the people even paul carefuly pics out his team members usealy consist of the very best

i dont know where he finds them but im greatful he does.

[cshell]

Speaking thru writing is difficult. Especially when there are many
cultures involved. Cultures in the US and Abroad.

It's best to read everything with a grain of salt.

[Dan Perez]

It's best to read everything with a grain of salt.

...not to mention shaded glasses

[UNICRON]

quoting: Dan Perez link=board=27;threadid=11108;start=0#msg72381 date=1057716165]

...not to mention shaded glasses

...and from the inside of a whiskey bottle (crown ofcourse)

[Krusty]

Wow You Low Water Mark,

You must be the friendliest person on the net, that I have to say,
....once I acted my own way.....I used too strong words, thanks to Paul I quitted being too stupid, and now on I always TRY to behave "professional" way, trying to block emotions away from my postings....well it is case sensitive when need to do it, but mostly ok.
There are so many rules that it is easier to tell what is allowed to say in here:
all what is security related or something to do with computers , right ?
( but then I do sound inhuman )
friendliest -Ari

[Pretender]

I must be really doing something wrong with not trying to. Whenever I make a post over at the Gladiator forums.......I get myself into trouble. I think I may be in big dog-do-do right now over there.....will find out in a couple because I check it after checking this board. I must offend some of the mods. I gotta get better or they are gonna boot me out.

[Paul Wilders]

quoting: Pretender link=board=27;threadid=11108;start=0#msg74087 date=1058482966]
I must be really doing something wrong with not trying to. Whenever I make a post over at the Gladiator forums.......I get myself into trouble....

These are the wilders forums - we do have a different attitude in regard to most other forums: respect, being polite - but all in for a decent discussion is part of our backbone.

You're doing fine over here

regards.

paul

[MickeyTheMan]

quoting: Pretender link=board=27;threadid=11108;start=0#msg74087 date=1058482966]
I must be really doing something wrong with not trying to. Whenever I make a post over at the Gladiator forums.......I get myself into trouble. I think I may be in big dog-do-do right now over there.....will find out in a couple because I check it after checking this board. I must offend some of the mods. I gotta get better or they are gonna boot me out.

Hey, don't worry about it Pal !
I'm a mod there, and i'm getting in trouble too, so .......

[Pretender]

Life moves on and it would be quite boring if we all understood everyone else I guess?!? Would be nice to stop wars over misunderstandings though!!!

Thanks all
bob

[Mr.Blaze]

gav bord?

wow it still around?

i thought it was gone after the fall of gav program

[Pretender]

Nope, the board is suppose to remain active and is now called "Gladiator Security Forum"

[Krusty]

Quote Paul:

These are the wilders forums - we do have a different attitude in regard to most other forums: respect, being polite

It´s Paul, he has something to do with this !

[Mr.Blaze]

it true try going to another bord with wilder logo in your sig and they flame you cause there al haters lol.

not wilders fault i get better service here

not wilders fault people here don't care where you come from or who you are they will still help you

not wilders fault paul went and hunt dowen all the best programs in his freebie section and found the best mods and admins that make this stuff so easy to learn.

man the list go on and on.

i like it here cause they remember what it was like to be a newbie and don't give me that high end talk

it all click here click there ok look there whats it say click there finish instructions .

ive gone to allot of boards and i have to say its more comfortable here

its kinda like taking off your shoes and stretching out you're toes and no one make bad faces at you for doing it cause there shoes are off to and they have a relax attitude around here

[Pretender]

So right you be Mr. Blaze!!!

[Prince_Serendip]

Hi LWM and Everyone!

I wholeheartedly agree with LowWaterMark's views at the beginning of this thread. I indeed have had many such encounters and experiences as he relates.

I consider that I got my start on the Boards here at Wilders. Paul and the rest of the crew here have set an excellent example of fair and evenhanded dealings with many different people. It helps me with my work at Gladiator Security each and every day. We are a profoundly International Board and it takes a great deal of flexibility to manage it.

As has been said, GAV is dead and its developer has been non-communicative. The Gladiator Board has always been seperate from the developer so that is why it is still around. We are becoming a fully seperate entity, a dedicated Security Board. Where we may have differed with Wilders in the past, is now history. We are now not much different from you. I would like our boards to be on friendly and respectful terms with each other, if that is still possible.

Here are some excerpts from the Gladiator Security Forum's Rules. (I wrote it.) They relate to much of what LowWaterMark was referring.

§ 1 Keep in mind that people of different languages, backgrounds, races, religions, etc will be posting here.
Treat others with respect and sensitivity.
Abusive, racist, harassing, or threatening behaviour will not be tolerated.
Be kind to newbies and help them out. Remember you were a newbie once and appreciated advice and answering of simple questions.

§ 3 Please take the time to consider the potential effects of your posts before you submit them. Forums postings are not private or confidential.

§ 5 We do not screen messages before they appear in our Forums. Please do not post messages which contain personal attacks. We want our conversations to be interesting and enjoyable. There is a difference between disagreeing with an idea and attacking a person. Please respect that difference.

Thus we can bring this thread back to the original topic.

I learned much of what I wrote above here at Wilders. It's the truth. Thank you all!


Warm regards from Larry

P.S. Note to Pretender and Mickey: You're not in trouble. You are okay by me. If you ever need my help, just ask. Glad to help.

[Pretender]

Very nicely put Prince_Serendip

[LowWaterMark]

quoting: Prince_Serendip link=board=27;threadid=11108;start=15#msg74550 date=1058704130]Here are some excerpts from the Gladiator Security Forum's Rules. (I wrote it.) They relate to much of what LowWaterMark was referring.

Hi Larry!

Thanks for the look into your forum rules. You've got many good points there, and I like how you have them structured on the board. In fact, the whole board looks really nice.

I would like our boards to be on friendly and respectful terms with each other, if that is still possible.

Certainly no reason this can't be possible. And, it's always good to see you here, as well.

Best Wishes,
LowWaterMark

[Mr.Blaze]

[the Tester]

I know what it's like to communicate with posters from other countries.
It can be an adventure at times.
Most of that comes from my heavy use of American "slang" in my language.
Someone from a different part of the World probably never hears my lingo.
So I learned while lurking in different forums to keep it simple,direct, and try at all costs to be respectful.

I was in a chat room with some Scottish guys once and I typed that "I have Scotch blood in me."
Whoops!
To the guys in that forum that implied that I was drunk on Scotch.
"Why is he talking about whiskey in his blood?"
That reminded me once again that my way of talking doesn't always translate the way that I think it will.

In this forum it is a lot easier to communicate with people from all over the globe.
Paul,the Mods,and the people here in general make it so much easier!