MSE Exclusions

[iravgupta]

Hi

I have read somewhere on this forum that adding explorer.exe to the exclusion list in MSE can speed things a bit when opening folders that contain a lot of items, especially executable files. This issue is more obvious in 32-bit Windows 7 as opposed to 64-bit Windows 7. In fact, uptil now, this was the main reason why I was not using MSE and did not use Live OneCare as my primary products. I have tried the same, and certainly this fix works well. Now what I am really interested in learning is that how far does this fix compromise the security of my system. Please note that I am talking about a system where no other antimalware app is installed.

[Cudni]

never heard of such fix and I would not have implemented even if I heard of it. I want my security software to check anything that can access malware. I would look in different avenues to find what causes slowdowns, are there big archives being scanned, hardware issues etc. etc.

[nanana1]

This is a classic illustration of humans and common sense being the most important factor and weakest link in using any AV protection software

[Greg S]

Originally Posted by ravi16aug

Hi

I have read somewhere on this forum that adding explorer.exe to the exclusion list in MSE can speed things a bit when opening folders that contain a lot of items, especially executable files. This issue is more obvious in 32-bit Windows 7 as opposed to 64-bit Windows 7. In fact, uptil now, this was the main reason why I was not using MSE and did not use Live OneCare as my primary products. I have tried the same, and certainly this fix works well. Now what I am really interested in learning is that how far does this fix compromise the security of my system. Please note that I am talking about a system where no other antimalware app is installed.

I have heard of it and it came from MS support if I'm not mistaken. I'm dual booting XP and Win 7. I installed MSE on Win 7 back on 10/22 and I notice exactly what you describe. In Win 7, I have not added explorer.exe as an exclusion. I did however reinstall MSE(ongoing beta) in XP the other day for about the 5th time and did add explorer.exe, svchost.exe, and MSE's engine to the excluded list. It tamed it to say the least and kinda did what I wanted which was to use MSE mostly as an ondemand, context menu scanner without disabling MSE from within it's own settings.

[Greg S]

Originally Posted by Cudni

I would look in different avenues to find what causes slowdowns, are there big archives being scanned, hardware issues etc. etc.

I'm sure many PC setups will respond in different ways with various apps and mine happens to be the one that always seems to be affected,lol. I diligently tested/checkded what you mention above with no joy. I even went to the point of excluding everything as a test, but it made no difference.

[iravgupta]

Originally Posted by nanana1

This is a classic illustration of humans and common sense being the most important factor and weakest link in using any AV protection software

And your reply illustrates the stuck-up nature exhibited by a few guys over this forum, which hinders a healthy discussion about anything. MSE is a good product, and I really want to use it, but given its current state, I am afraid I cannot. I wanted to help people identify issues with this product and somehow indirectly be a part of the development of a better version of MSE. The same characteristic is exhibited by AVG 9 as well. The only products I have seen not suffering from this problem are Avira and avast!.

[iravgupta]

Originally Posted by Greg S

I have heard of it and it came from MS support if I'm not mistaken. I'm dual booting XP and Win 7. I installed MSE on Win 7 back on 10/22 and I notice exactly what you describe. In Win 7, I have not added explorer.exe as an exclusion. I did however reinstall MSE(ongoing beta) in XP the other day for about the 5th time and did add explorer.exe, svchost.exe, and MSE's engine to the excluded list. It tamed it to say the least and kinda did what I wanted which was to use MSE mostly as an ondemand, context menu scanner without disabling MSE from within it's own settings.

I don`t think this has turned MSE into a true on-demand scanner. Try downloading an EICAR test file and see MSE spring into action. I believe that in its present state, your MSE has turned into an on-execution instead of an on-access scanner.

[boesdad]

I came across this document from microsoft that indicates what
files to exclude.... Hope it helps.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/822158

[nanana1]

Originally Posted by ravi16aug

MSE is a good product, and I really want to use it, but given its current state, I am afraid I cannot. I wanted to help people identify issues with this product and somehow indirectly be a part of the development of a better version of MSE. The same characteristic is exhibited by AVG 9 as well. The only products I have seen not suffering from this problem are Avira and avast!.

I am a strong supporter of MSE when it was first launched and still is. I have converted a good number of systems to MSE now and all are running problem-free. The current version is working good and of course, can be improved.

You really should be looking at your own computer system and what you've done with it. If you would reinstall a fresh version of Windows and install MSE, you will not face the problems you bring here and seek to try to improve MSE instead of improving your own computer system.

[Fajo]

You have no idea what he would face with a fresh install of Windows and MSE. I can't use MSE on this computer because as it causes mass slow downs. This was on a FRESH IMAGE of Windows XP SP3 and MSE, unfortunately it is the program it self and I refuse to add exclusions that punch holes in security. So for now MSE is not on my recommend list but if these are fixed I will recommend it along with other free solutions.

[nanana1]

You also should be looking at your FRESH IMAGE of Windows XP SP3, unfortunately you did not mention the many other softwares installed on your so called FRESH IMAGE that may not work well with MSE.

If you install a new Windows without your other softwares and had problems with MSE, then I'll be convinced. As I said, I've installed and use MSE on my many computers without any problems

[funkydude]

Originally Posted by nanana1

If you install a new Windows without your other softwares and had problems with MSE, then I'll be convinced. As I said, I've installed and use MSE on my many computers without any problems

Never seen anyone experience a problem with MSE on a fresh install of Windows 7 at least.

Currently what I seem to be recommending a lot to people is wipe to win7 64 and install MSE. They never seem to have problems with that.

[Fajo]

Originally Posted by nanana1

You also should be looking at your FRESH IMAGE of Windows XP SP3, unfortunately you did not mention the many other softwares installed on your so called FRESH IMAGE that may not work well with MSE.

If you install a new Windows without your other softwares and had problems with MSE, then I'll be convinced. As I said, I've installed and use MSE on my many computers without any problems

Last I checked fresh image means NOTHING but Windows 7 It was made after Windows 7 was installed and Updated, It's made with Windows 7 own image creator. After it finished reverting to that image I then installed MSE. I have fresh installed copy's of Windows 7, Vista and XP. All seem to have the SAME effect on this computer

MSE slows my laptop down considerably. Now if I add the exclusions from Microsoft the computer runs fine but again with security programs I'm unwilling to accept work around as they should not be needed and can decrease security.

[Greg S]

Originally Posted by boesdad

I came across this document from microsoft that indicates what
files to exclude.... Hope it helps.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/822158

Thanks and nice find! However can anyone translate some this for me? I've seen better understanding coming from homeade handbill for yard sale,lol. In that article, were there only files mentioned or was there a folder that should be excluded? I know it says "Where a specific set of files is identified by name, exclude only those files instead of the whole folder." Unless I missed it, I didn't see a folder exclusion, is this correct? Also, I only had about half of the files mentioned and I couldn't find this folder "%allusersprofile%\"

Nevermind, the above is in XP only.

[NAMOR]

Anyone having issue with MSE try the unofficial repair utility?

http://social.answers.microsoft.com/...6-c0342a195176

[IceCube1010]

I've never come across any of these problems mentioned here while using MSE on a Vista Home, WinXP Home and Professional OS. The only issue I had was with the updater. On some computers, it works fine on others it does not update. I really don't like any 3rd party updater. I just wish someone would have an answer for the updater.

Ice

[YeOldeStonecat]

On really old slow systems you may have to just stick with Avira, as it's the lightests of the free AVs ...well..lightest including paid ones too.

Although I focus on business networks, I do a lot of side stuff with friends/family/neighbors...and the home PCs of staff at many of my clients. I've installed MSE on hundreds of systems already, and unless they have a really old beaten down system, MSE doesn't bog them down much. On the antiquated systems like early P4s with 512 megs or less....I just stick with Avira. If they're not going to upgrade their PC to something a bit more contemporary, Avira's the only choice they have.

Seat of the pants got me to feeling MSE was lighter than AVG and Avast as far as the other freebies are concerned, and lighter than NOD32v4 which is the pay for product I install the most. About equal to NOD32v3.

AV-Comparatives performance tests produced similar results also.

Even on my aging gaming PC...XPp, first generation C2D, 3 gigs...I use MSE on it and even leave real time protection enabled while playing my heavy online games like the Battlefield series.

[Fajo]

I wish this was the issue on my system as it would be a simple fix. But it is not as my oldest computer now is a laptop that is 9 months old and Mid grade. The rest of the computers are Mid to High grade level. Even the oldest computer has 4 gigs of ram and runs a dual core. So I don't see how that would cause my issue.

[iravgupta]

Ok guys, before this argument ventures into the realms of fanboyism, let me make sure that we are all on the same page regarding the issue.
First of all, the system I am testing it on is an Acer Aspire 4736 notebook, with 2.2 GHz C2D, 3 GB RAM, Intel 4500MHD and featuring a clean install of Windows 7 Home Premium 32-bit with all updates in place. Apart from drivers, there is no other application installed. I then proceed by installing and updating MSE, and rebooting the system. At this point my observations are:
1. Opening a folder full of executable files, it takes significant time for each application`s icon to be rendered completely. In fact, its like a slowly dropping curtain. If you open the same folder again, the lag disappears, but appears again after a system reboot.
2. Opening the Add-Remove programs applet results in the same issue, as each application`s icon will take its own sweet time to render, again the curtain effect in its full glory. Even here, if you reopen the applet, the lag will be gone but if you do so after a reboot, the lag appears.
3. Download a file from your favorite browser, and try to save it in a folder which has some executable files. The 'Save As' dialog box will again take a good bit of time before it can render the folder contents easily.

At first, I thought that this happens because MSE has not yet completed a full scan of my system, and thus needs to scan each file before freeing it for explorer. But even after running a very long 'Full Scan' all observations reported above hold true.
The point to note here is that these issues are not so prominent in a 64-bit environment.
To repeat myself, this sort of behavior is exhibited by AVG too. Avira and avast! are thankfully not plagued by this problem.
Lets discuss how to deal with this and stop doubting each other`s technical prowess.

[Greg S]

Originally Posted by ravi16aug

Ok guys, before this argument ventures into the realms of fanboyism, let me make sure that we are all on the same page regarding the issue.
First of all, the system I am testing it on is an Acer Aspire 4736 notebook, with 2.2 GHz C2D, 3 GB RAM, Intel 4500MHD and featuring a clean install of Windows 7 Home Premium 32-bit with all updates in place. Apart from drivers, there is no other application installed. I then proceed by installing and updating MSE, and rebooting the system. At this point my observations are:
1. Opening a folder full of executable files, it takes significant time for each application`s icon to be rendered completely. In fact, its like a slowly dropping curtain. If you open the same folder again, the lag disappears, but appears again after a system reboot.
2. Opening the Add-Remove programs applet results in the same issue, as each application`s icon will take its own sweet time to render, again the curtain effect in its full glory. Even here, if you reopen the applet, the lag will be gone but if you do so after a reboot, the lag appears.
3. Download a file from your favorite browser, and try to save it in a folder which has some executable files. The 'Save As' dialog box will again take a good bit of time before it can render the folder contents easily.

Perfect description of my experience with Win 7 32!

[funkydude]

What an intelligent post ravi, a delight to read. I personally use 64bit of windows 7 which could explain why I don't seem to notice this, but I'm a bit skeptical about it.

I personally think the main effect of it must be hard drive read speed. Hence why some people with really fast and really slow CPU's report the same problem. Also why the effect is more prominent in folders with a large amount of files (more data to read at one time).

[InfinityAz]

Originally Posted by ravi16aug

1. Opening a folder full of executable files, it takes significant time for each application`s icon to be rendered completely. In fact, its like a slowly dropping curtain. If you open the same folder again, the lag disappears, but appears again after a system reboot.
2. Opening the Add-Remove programs applet results in the same issue, as each application`s icon will take its own sweet time to render, again the curtain effect in its full glory. Even here, if you reopen the applet, the lag will be gone but if you do so after a reboot, the lag appears.
3. Download a file from your favorite browser, and try to save it in a folder which has some executable files. The 'Save As' dialog box will again take a good bit of time before it can render the folder contents easily.

Running Win 7 home premium 64-bit and experience the same effects you describe in your post. After I excluded explorer.exe, issues 1 and 3 stopped. Issue 2 continues but I can live with it. Also, this is true on both of my computers running Win 7 64-bit.

[Greg S]

Originally Posted by funkydude

I personally think the main effect of it must be hard drive read speed. Hence why some people with really fast and really slow CPU's report the same problem. Also why the effect is more prominent in folders with a large amount of files (more data to read at one time).

Not here, I admit my notebook is about 4 years old but the HD is a Seagate 7200 rpm and large cache which I keep fairly cool with 20 inch box fan blowing on it, lol

[Fajo]

Originally Posted by funkydude

What an intelligent post ravi, a delight to read. I personally use 64bit of windows 7 which could explain why I don't seem to notice this, but I'm a bit skeptical about it.

I personally think the main effect of it must be hard drive read speed. Hence why some people with really fast and really slow CPU's report the same problem. Also why the effect is more prominent in folders with a large amount of files (more data to read at one time).

LOL I have not had a Hard Drive under 8 meg cache or a CPU under 1.8GHZ duo in along time. Even budge computers now have at least a 7200 RPM Hard Drive with a 8meg cache and come with a Core duo. People should not have any issue when it comes to this side of computing especially with a Anti-Virus.

[funkydude]

Originally Posted by Fajo

LOL I have not had a Hard Drive under 8 meg cache or a CPU under 1.8GHZ duo in along time. Even budge computers now have at least a 7200 RPM Hard Drive with a 8meg cache and come with a Core duo. People should not have any issue when it comes to this side of computing especially with a Anti-Virus.

Sigh, it was an opinion, but feel free to go psycho over it.