Matousec needs some more tests.

[gh0st]

SammyJack you said enough to be sue if they really hired fine lawyers for such statements ;-)

[BlueZannetti]

Folks,

Let's lay off the gratuitous commentary regarding lawyers/etc.. That's basically meaningless posturing from all sides in this discussion and contributes nothing.

Back on topic or thread is closed.

Blue

[gh0st]

Ok Let's stop about melih too there is no reason to focus on this. Remember that this HIPS was wrongly targeted as adware before.

In my opinion there shouldn't be necessarily any contradiction in aiming 100% in ''tests'' and focusing on ''real protection'' and users feedback. Now i use it for a very long time on one of my computer and so far it does it job ( except the recent flaw in database update). PcTools free Firewall looks fine too according to experimented users. Tests are always based on the past and eventually just failed for weak tools or misconfigured computers.

[Kevin McAleavey]

Originally Posted by BlueZannetti

Folks,

Let's lay off the gratuitous commentary regarding lawyers/etc.. That's basically meaningless posturing from all sides in this discussion and contributes nothing.

Back on topic or thread is closed.

Blue

Right you are!

Matousec came along after the days of BOClean and so I'm not personally aware of them, but I remember another questionable "testing operation" that sure did help BOClean's demise. Testing of software is a good thing when it's conducted properly by impartial testers with nothing to gain other than admiration for their work in the public interest.

What's disturbing about this "testing organization" is the blatant "click on the link to buy so WE get paid." It's been quite common in the past among these "pay us to test" (one way or another) operations for the highest bidder to come out ahead in those tests, perhaps be granted "makeup tests" if they don't make the cut the first time, all for the benefit of the testers themselves rather than the public which "trusts" these test results.

What exactly did Matousec use for those tests and what were the exact parameters to ensure that the testing was a real world test? It's not unusual for many of these ad-hoc testers to put together their tests using malware which is specifically chosen from zoos which were never "in the wild" or worse, tests carefully constructed by pre-testing those vendors they want to come out poorly to select their test regime to favor of those vendors who are willing to "affiliate program" them for the fees collected. Seen that too over the years. And anything which is unique is bound to fail a test if it doesn't properly fit the 1980's expectations and pigeonholes. BOClean constantly took it in the ear because it wasn't a file scanner, wasn't a firewall, wasn't HIPS and therefore couldn't be compared to anything else. Our reward for the uniqueness was ending up eaten by COMODO.

But the bottom line here is that by becoming an affiliate of the "winners" and seeking commissions on sales, that certainly raises serious questions for any "test organization." That all said, COMODO does deserve kudos for the improvements they've made in the two years I was with them until they kicked me and BOClean to the curb this past June. Had they listened to my advice when I first came aboard, they would have been here much sooner.

But that's all water under the bridge now. They *did* add BOClean to their AV, and they finally did what I told Melih the first time we met after I was hired - specifically that "white listing" was the only way to win, and that blacklisting was destined to fail. If COMODO does something someday about their internal communications issues, they'll be a formidable Windows security operation. But kudos to them anyway for coming as far as they have despite the "short attention span theater" aspects of their management.

I was never fond of the AV "way" of doing things (which is why BOClean was so unique) and my involvement with COMODO demanding doing more of the same convinced me that Windows is indefensible with 1980's technology with chrome hubcaps on it. So I've personally moved on to a new operating system that Nancy and I started working on between the time we knew BOClean was no longer paying the bills here and prior to joining COMODO. After COMODO, we've returned to that project and I'm grateful that I no longer have to live in Billyworld. Now if only we could get funding to share it with the world, it'd be a happy place for everyone. No AV needed, cannot possibly get infected and it's *not* Linux either. Been using it exclusively here as have a few friends ever since I left COMODO. It's amusing whilst surfing getting warnings from google, "this site might damage your computer" and thrashing the keyboard with "I wanna SEE it, go away! Leave me alone!" Heh.

So there's all my cards on the table, my motivations for what I've said, and my attitude towards the neverending game of 1980's technologies in the 21st century, and all the players therein. Just honks me off after all these years that it's still the same old, same old ... same for the tests. We'd probably be a LOT better off if us coders didn't have to code for TESTS and instead code for the real world. But it's those testers we have to beat, not the criminals. We don't get graded by the malware authors after all. So no sense worrying about them if the testers don't have their stuff.

/rant mode off ... had lots of things bottled up during my "dismissal quiet time." Have plenty more, but not now - I have a headache.

---

edited: fixed random keystrokes

[Rednose!]

Hey Kev

Another question is : Who is ( are ) behind DIFINEX (DIFferent INternet EXperience) Ltd. , the company that bought Matousec That is not clear either !

Off topic : Kev, is your operating system based on BSD, or am I totaly wrong here

Greetz, Red.

[tipstir]

Most of Comodo free tools seem to have issues but the EasyVPN which is just VPN connection for Private Instant Messaging. That's a great tool! I am still not convince about the CIS, AV, Cleaner, I did try that BOClean nah!

[Kevin McAleavey]

Originally Posted by Rednose!

Hey Kev

Another question is : Who is ( are ) behind DIFINEX (DIFferent INternet EXperience) Ltd. , the company that bought Matousec That is not clear either !

Off topic : Kev, is your operating system based on BSD, or am I totaly wrong here

Greetz, Red.

Howdy, stranger! Long time no type!

I know absolutely nothing of Matousec or those other guys - somehow I suspect I don't want to. Heh. Some fast giggling only seems to indicate that they were "acquired" and something about a new level of creating "trust." Been there. Done that. Trust is EARNED, you can't "create" it. I was just gassing off about these "testers" on a generic basis, it's been AGES since I've seen any that weren't taking kickbacks for their results. I'm sure you read years ago about the "gizmo" saga (and others) and how we were constantly getting outbid with BOClean. Just bothers me when I see what is supposed to be a "product comparison" looking to get paid when the "tests" aren't clear as to what they're testing, and with what, and then they REtest and make like the first test never happened. When I saw how the results stacked up there, something was obviously not right. Then again, seen it all before.

Wouldn't it be *really* neat for one of these "tests" to include several "file infectors" and find out if certain proggies can actually REPAIR an infected file and recover it or is it just deleted? That'd be an interesting test. Sadly, a lot of the popular antimalware proggies do NOT have the ability to actually clean infected files like the classic AV's they're being compared to, and so if there's a blacklist match, then important files just go poof and your system gets clobbered. Or worse, they ignore the problem and you remain infected. Sadly, "file infectors" are back in a BIG way in the past year and change ... when I was with COMODO, I ended up having little to do in the second year and during that time, I figured out how the 1980's AV's did it. Turned out to be ridiculously simple. But nobody was listening when I had the answer, so I eventually gave up. And from what I've seen of some of the other vendors, same issue as far as cleaning files goes.

Same for another valid testing issue called "currency" ... a test comprised of things found out there in the wild as of the DAY of the test. Many vendors whose priority is "passing tests" pay more attention to waiting for OTHER vendors to identify the mystery meat, and if enough of them diagnose it as malware, it goes to the head of the line and gets added even if it's ten years old and not seen since then. Otherwise, today's "critical sample" arrives among thousands of other samples and thus a zero day might not be detected for weeks or even months. After all, if you're trying to pass tests, you concentrate on those zoos and matching score with the other vendors who have been around for a while. Even MORE important if you know which zoos you're being tested on, and if you fail at first and get a second chance KNOWING what you failed on, there's your priority. That was done with BOClean once and it bothered the hell out of me. There's no priority in the "brand new" as that rarely affects the testing results. Such is only important to customers, not the testers.

If *I* were running a "testing" thingummy, that's the way I would choose to test but then that's just me. Hmmmm ... maybe I can make some money here. Heh.

As to "project KNOS" (that's its temporary name, "Kevin & Nancy's OS") it is indeed derived from BSD, but a much later version than Mac OSX chose, and runs on a much greater variety of hardware. And unlike BSD, it's actually easier and friendlier than Windows (and especially Linux) and the GUI we've assembled looks like a cross between Vista and OSX. We took the best aspects of both and melded them into something that makes sense. KNOS even runs classic DOS and some Win32 stuff but actually contains its own versions of various things from browsers to office stuff. Even comes with just about everything everyone already uses on Windows. We even let you READ your Windows disk, USB's, etc into our OS should you want to export stuff to sites. And we protect those from attack as well because nobody can write to them! We also provide a means to copy back with protection using a USB stick as an intermediary though so that you can turn off the internet in Windows should you want to continue to use that on your machine. But I only use Windows rarely now - this is really that much better. No joke!

The PRIMARY value to what we've done however is assembling a "world" where you don't HAVE to use a firewall, don't NEED an AV, and in the event that somewhere down the road it becomes popular enough and someone actually finds some means of exploiting KNOS, just turn it off and start it again, and whatever happened never happened, nothing can possibly stick.

I think that's a useful answer to the problem of malware, and it's designed for people who can't tell the difference between a computer and a toaster. That was our design philosophy with NSClean, IEClean, BOClean and all else Nancy and I did for the intarwebs. Make it simple, make it unobtrusive, and leave folks alone to what they want to do in peace and privacy. There's nothing anyone has to do other than use it. Worries not included, no need for them. You can even look at PDF's, Flash content, anything that's deadly on Windows and still no worries. We even handle privacy issues like we did with NSClean and IEClean. Close the browser, kiss your trail byebye! Everything you do gets forgotten as soon as you do it. (grin)

Only problem we have right now is we're ready to go with it, but can't find sufficient financing at the moment to "make it so." We're working on that ... if anyone here is actually intested, I'll post some screenies another time. It's pretty.

But our particular problem right now is that the distribution is about 1.4 gigabytes. The bandwidth is a killer and without any income at the moment, can't be handing it out right now except in person. However, in the hands of an operation that DOES have the bandwidth (and the morals) to do this - KNOS is bound to be far more useful than Ubuntu or anything like it. So that's where things are right now ... glad to hear from ya buddy! Wish 3xist had bothered to tell me I'd been fired, but then you know how COMODO does things. Started writing a book about it.

---

Edit: Damned random keystrokes! Heh.

[aigle]

i wil love to see some screen shots of it. Better yet to post a video of it on some web site and you might find some one to finance it.

[Dragons Forever]

Originally Posted by Kevin McAleavey

Wish 3xist had bothered to tell me I'd been fired, but then you know how COMODO does things. Started writing a book about it.

I'm sorry, I am really confused by this statement.

A) I never knew you even left Comodo! Nor got sacked.
B) "Wish 3xist had bothered to tell me I'd been fired" - Can you please explain this a bit more? I have no affiliation with Comodo, Nor am I a Employer/Employee.

Unless I am misunderstanding something...

Cheers,
Josh

[LaserWraith]

Originally Posted by Kevin McAleavey

Wish 3xist had bothered to tell me I'd been fired, but then you know how COMODO does things. Started writing a book about it.

Just a note...Melih replied to this.

Originally Posted by Melih, CEO of Comodo

We acquired a company that was not making ends meet....
Kevin, according to his claims, was working day and night creating signatures for BOClean and even that wasn't enough. Obviously they were not making money, hence were selling the company. We acquired the company and our guys took over sig creation for Boclean, Kevin was very grateful.

My thought for the acquisition was that: Kevin could come and help with our AV initiatives. Hence I acquired BOclean. Once we started the work, I was disappointed as Kevin really didn't want to fight the malware anymore, understandable.. he was burnt out imo....Kevin was working from his home and not from our offices. We tried to get him involved in different projects to no avail. Of course all during this time he was a fully paid staff member and I don't think he was enjoying that level of income when we acquired his company and btw: we were paying "rent" so that he can work from his own house too! So believe me, we tried.. I tried and failed...then Umesh tried and failed to get Kevin involved in projects. As a last resource we said, hey at least help us create some sigs...that didn't go well either....Having tried all that, we had no alternative but reluctantly to let him go.

When he was told we were terminating his employment, he informed us that he had this new project he was working on. At that point, I just wished him well.

and I still do.

Things didn't work out between Kevin and Comodo and these things happen. I am glad I was able to help Kevin for the period he was employed by Comodo as previously i know he was struggling financially. So at least I can say, I tried and I did actually help him by providing him employment and salary that he much needed.

Kevin is an intelligent guy and I wish him all the best, there is no animosity from my side at all and I wish him well.

Melih

http://forums.comodo.com/general_dis...5731#msg335731

Edit: the link isn't working - it was off-topic and moved.

[BlueZannetti]

Folks,

We're starting to wander far afield of the thread topic.

Let's keep the focus here on Matousec, and if additional topics warrant discussion, let's open a new thread for that purpose.

Thanks in advance.

Blue

[gh0st]

Yes sir ;-)

1) You can reproduce the test : http://www.matousec.com/downloads/ssts.zip

2) Comodo HIPS is a average good solution under a weak OS.

3) I won't trust them.

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: DIFINEX.COM
Created on: 09-Apr-09
Expires on: 09-Apr-12
Last Updated on: 09-Apr-09

Originally Posted by BlueZannetti

Let's keep the focus here on Matousec

I see where Kaspersky Internet Security 2010 does better than Steganos Internet Security 2008. Who would think two-year-old software wouldn't fare that well? THANKS Matousec!!

[CogitoTesting]

Originally Posted by Kevin McAleavey

Right you are!

So I've personally moved on to a new operating system that Nancy and I started working on between the time we knew BOClean was no longer paying the bills here and prior to joining COMODO. After COMODO, we've returned to that project and I'm grateful that I no longer have to live in Billyworld. Now if only we could get funding to share it with the world, it'd be a happy place for everyone. No AV needed, cannot possibly get infected and it's *not* Linux either. Been using it exclusively here as have a few friends ever since I left COMODO. It's amusing whilst surfing getting warnings from google, "this site might damage your computer" and thrashing the keyboard with "I wanna SEE it, go away! Leave me alone!" Heh.
---
edited: fixed random keystrokes

Hi Kevin

Have you contacted Google for your operating system. I'm pretty sure they will be glad to talk to you. Or if the Google route does not work well contact Microsoft or even Canonical the company behind Ubuntu.

Google: http://www.google.com/contact/

Microsoft: http://support.microsoft.com/contactus/?ws=mscom

Canonical: http://www.canonical.com/aboutus/contactus

[Mapson]

Originally Posted by Kevin McAleavey

But our particular problem right now is that the distribution is about 1.4 gigabytes. The bandwidth is a killer and without any income at the moment, can't be handing it out right now except in person.

BitTorrent or similar? - http://www.bittorrent.com/dna

[gh0st]

The speculation on KNOS is humorous. For those who have encouraged us, stay tuned. For now, because I am on unemployment (thanks, Melih) I cannot work on the KNOS project nor can I do anything on "Looking for work" time and that's highly limiting since it's on hold until either I can gain employment with someone willing to develop it, or have investors come forward saying "let's see this - WE'LL pay you for your time." Such is the damocles sword.

KNOS isn't going anywhere in the short term (as stated by the author)

(from Comodo forums)

KNOS is a ... vaporware ?

[Xitrum]

KIS2010 build 736 scored the perfect 100% against matousec attack exploit security test suite.

[Fajo]

Originally Posted by Xitrum

KIS2010 build 736 scored the perfect 100% against matousec attack exploit security test suite.

And my Dog jumped Thur a Hoop today.... That's about just as valid as those tests on that Site.