Sun Java inquiry

[snowy]

A few days ago I instally Sun Java for a particular program that would not run without it.......an since then my system seems to have a resource problem.....the day after installing the Sun Java.....M$ came out with a critical upday for Virtual Machine (Java)......an I installed it

The M$ java is being ignorred by the java applets I use......instead the Sun Java is used...........is it possible there is a conflict here? An perhaps the M$ java keeps draining the resources by trying to open. I ran out of memory several times today......an my os never has done that before...........very little in start-up.

any suggestions would be appreciated......once I start my security programs resouces drop to 35% an below.....with a memory manager working......less than 40% on a windows os is not so good..

snowman

[snowy]

Having made a few tweaks.....an disabling several programs......resources back up to 54% GDI 69 with two windows open and a java applet running.......thats not so bad.........but still have two programs in need of running .......prior to this my os never dropped below 60%...


snowman

[Pieter_Arntz]

snowy,

Not a permanent solution, but I hope it does the trick.
If you doubleclick Java Plugin in the config.screen, you can check the box for "Show Java in system tray"
Using the icon in the systray should enable you to rightclick that icon and click exit when you don´t need it.
In this way it will only "drain" your resources at the moments you really need it.

Regards,

Pieter

[snowy]

Pieter

most appreciate your reply.......an it did work to some extent........unfortunately I run java applets for several hours each day..........I did in the past also an never had this problem......so right now I am at a lost.....my os is tweaked fairly well.......normally zoooooms........

had to disable the desktop security.....which also worked to prevent hacking of the os by preventing access to much of the system........shut-down my proxies (all of them) even went as far as un-installing several programs I don't use.........right now at 48%.........an think I can get that up alittle........something will just have to go.....

thank you my friend for your help

snowman

[Pieter_Arntz]

snowy,

I don´t understand why this is happening to you. I just tested at dslreports (the scanning tools always automatically start the Sun Java) and my CPU usage went up from ca 3% to ca 5% (averages ofcourse) and the memory usage did not increase noticeably.

I´ll see if I can come up with something else,

Pieter

[snowy]

Pieter

thank you very much for giving of your time to test and check............truely I am baffled by whats happening...but it may not in fact be a JAVA issue after all.....I now have java off.......an system still running at near max..........no trojans or viruses......I seem to have an open program somewhere thats draining resouces..........unless....maybe I am being DOS.......my system will strongly resist a DOS attack an use resources doing so.......I'll knocked everything off my ports an see what happens...an get back


snowman

[Pieter_Arntz]

Hi snowy,

This little program might help you analyze your troubles: http://www.wt-rate.com/wintaskman/ I´m sorry it´s in German, but I could not find anything like it in English. If you need help in translating, just let us know.
Or someone else might know a similar program in English?

Regards,

Pieter

[snowy]

Pieter

just downloaded the program....at .58 bp/s.......good gosh took several minutes to download 332 kb

again thanking you.........much appreciate your help.


snowman

[snowy]

Pieter

installed and ran the program you post......wasn't to difficult to understand. The program shows my os to be alright, BUT...now my mouse has gone crazy! Can just barely control it........my first thought was: TROGAN....but os appears clean after several scans....no, this is a conflict problem that I will just need to locate and fix....
os stable at 50%......at start-up 96%

Have truely appreciated all your help.

snowman

[snowy]

Pieter

Just thought this may be of some interest to you...I have re-gain some control over the resource issue....
two issues I failed to mention earlier was the lost of control of the mouse....and the desktop icons either turning completely black or completely white.......plus, whenever a java applet was use several of the program icons being displeyed in the tasktray would turn white..or green.....extremely odd behavior..............the use of < yahoo messenger> appears to have caused the icon issue...but WHY??
I've no idea as yet what caused the lost of mouse control........I could not even shut-down or close programs.....an had to actually un-plug the computer.
after nearly 24 hours.......now I seem to have located a solution that is working...........using one of my security programs that locks the computer from being accessed....I disabled numerous functions......when I disabled msdos prompt....I regained control !! repeat: very odd. Other functions are disabled such as.. access to network....control panal....in other words access to the "guts" of the system...of course I personally can still access these...no one else......
have run update anti-virus and anti-trogan scans...monitered both inbound and out bound,,,,,,completed cleaned and wiped the C drive..temp folder..index dat...garbage folders (M$) none of which worked to resolved the problem of control lostage......only by locking functions did that return
my first thought was that somehow..someone had gained remote control of the computer....or there was a trogan hidden.......for the moment I will continue on that thought...yet..nothing turning up so far.....
this is just to give you an update of whats happening......recently I installed several new programs..if something got in..........it will be found eventually....

snowman

[Pieter_Arntz]

Hi snowy,

Good to see you have regained control, to say the least.
Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly do you mean by:
-{ Quote: "using one of my security programs that locks the computer from being accessed....I disabled numerous functions......when I disabled msdos prompt...." }-?

Regards,

Pieter

[snowy]

Pieter

its a program that prevents others for accessing my computer by shutting down or restricting chosen functions...FE: can prevent access to the Start Botton....Desktop....Control Panal....all drives...TaskManager..Display Properties....safe mode....Ctr;&alt&delete......Boot.....much more
these functions still work for me..no one else....

[Pieter_Arntz]

Ah, I think I know what you mean. You denied access to these functions for other users.
But I presume you don´t have Printer- and Filesharing enabled in the properties for your Internetconnection?

Regards,

Pieter

[snowy]

*But I presume you don´t have Printer- and Filesharing enabled in the properties for your Internetconnection **


Pieter

no those are not enabled...however, it would not change anything if it were........access would remain restricted.........of course...nothing is un-breakable...I keep that in mind LOL

got to go out for awhile...later my friend


snowman

p.s. resiurces have remained stable at 41% running several programs......deliberately alittle overloaded to see results.

[snowy]

Pieter

after three hours.....still in control......don't have slightest idea how this fix is working....oddly the security program is not issueing any alerts of attempts to tamper with the os........this baffles me because it would if in fact it was the "fix".....but without it = lost of control.

looks like this is going to take awhile.....very curious to see if this is some sort of morph trogan/virus......whatever it is comes from inside my system......WSH is enabled...will disable that next........trial by error LOL

snowman

[Pieter_Arntz]

Keep us posted, snowy.
I´m curious as well. Your solution could indicate some program was using a DOS based routine that somehow "hung". But since everything you want to run seems to work, it might be malware that caused your problems.

Take care,

Pieter

[snowy]

DAY 3


Pieter

I would very much tend to agree with you....there is some program involded....an most defintely DOS is involved.
for the first time in the life of this computer it ran OUT of resources.....several times last night.
the ONLY new program running at each time was Yahoo Messenger............every other program I've been using for years without incident or resouce lostage......normally computer never below 60% free resources.......
this yahoo messenger displays ads....of which are being blocked........also..althought set not to do so......the Updater keeps trying to access the internet.......also...have recorded numerous "echo" requests from a yahoo server
all in all.....if this yahoo messenger is the problem.....that may raise a few eyebrows.......
since I never used messengers prior to a week ago....I will locate a non-yahoo messenger an see if I have the same results.......if anyone reading this could suggest a decent messenger it would be apprecisted....I just need one for "traffic".........an never actually "chat"


snowman

[the Tester]

Snowy.I use Yahoo Messenger myself.I took the up-grade to version 5.5 last weekend.I have noticed that yahoo messenger adds programs like Yahoo companion and a few other yahoo features(Space hogs).I haven't had any problems like what you have.I just don't like those added programs.I took the full download and now I regret it.I think I had 5.0 before.That was better IMO.

[snowy]

TheTester

Well don't feel bad....I choose not to have the extras installed.....guess what.....the extras were installed anyway!
this yahoo messenger is very suspious.....far to much activity.......needs a good exam......
I just downloaded Trillian........I don't next to nothing about these messengers......never felt they were safe so kept away from them......right now I believe its the Y messenger causing my problem..........my os is not like everyone's.....alot of stuff is prevented........
one particular yahoo ad will freeze my computer :

"YOU HAVE ONE MESSAGE" (is the one)

it just hangs.

today is the eight day of my re-connecting to the internet.....an all week bad memories of past experiences with the net have been returning.......oops...resources just dropped to 38%...got to go


snowman

[snowy]

Well enough of this nonsense..the Y messenger has to go....will un-install..clean registry..ete....an wipe c drive....its going to the garbage can !!!!


snowman

[Krusty]

Hey peeps

Task monitor application here: http://www.iarsn.com/download.html
Snow , have you tweaked on sys.ini [Vcache] ?

-Ari

[snowy]

Krusty

Good Day! No..having been so busy on the resource problem....plus installing .....making setting....whew..just no spare time.............closing the Y messenger helps greatly..it was using 12% resources..........

got to get a bite of food now....hungry....will get back to the os after I chill-out awhile.........had hope to have avoided all the tweaking.......but wont be able to I suppose.


snowman


Oh, Krusty that "trick" you shared with me works really well........much appreciate...

[snowy]

First: my apology that this thread has become so long>



But....in summation......it WAS the sun java after all...finally caught it the act..!! Totally caught by accident.

Have un-install the sun java....for the brief time since then my os appears more stable.......programs that were "shaky" are now responding normally.......but will wait awhile before passing final judgement.......since resources are remaing very low......
apperantly the sun java would try to open under certain circumstances...an was being blocked outbound ...either by the setting in internet explorer zones or the firewall....either case os resources would immediately drop to near zero.......emergency shut down required before computer stopped responding..........thats all the details I have to offer at this point.
I've always thought that Sun Java was better that M$ java.....an will continue to do so.....there was a major conflict of some sort here that eludes me right now.......Sun java in this particular case just did not "mix" into my os.....
the program it was required for was a stock market streamer from a reputable source......since why sun java was needed for this particular program of that I have no idea.......my other streamers work just fine without sun java...just the M$ java.........
so perhaps this post can be now considered a "heads-up" to others experiencing such problems.

Thank you one and all for your most helpful help during this trying time....

snowman

[Prince_Serendip]

:) Hello snowman!

Just to let you know, I uninstalled all Yahoo stuff months ago. They are resource hogs! And, I don't trust them. I also turned off ALL automatic updaters. It happened once in the middle of a large d/l, an auto update turned on and crashed my whole box. I, and only I, shall command updates!

If you need any help with Trillian, let me know because I use it too. I hope things work out well for you.

From your friend Larry! :)

[snowy]

Prince

most appreciate your offer.....an may take you up on it.
WHEW>>>>what a weekend that was!! Exhusted me trying to locate the problem prior to Monday morning
all in all I am not comfortable as yet.....sun java just should not have caused this havox....yet for sure it did.

well...now that the dust is settling....will try an relax for a couple of hours.....before researching this further...
have a pleasent day and week Larry....oh..noticed the post about the hacker......

snowman

[Ghost]

snowman - http://www.securiteam.com/windowsntfocus/6B00E0060S.html

(The above is why I use SJ instead of M$ for both IE and Opera). It's possible that you've got an older version of SJ - the latest one is 1.4.1, available here: http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.4.1/ .

Might want to read here: http://www.lurkhere.com/forum768.html about the ICQ/Trillian combo.

[snowy]

Ghost

thank you for the reply....I will read both links you kindly provided.
the version you posted is the version I had.....BUT>>BUT.....along with it came something called: "Web Start".........when cleaning the registry I removed several titled: "Javasoft" which was part of the install................definitely I want to inquire into this deeper.
on the by and by.....since removing the sun java the system has remained stable for the past several hours.... with java applets enabled...also.

beginning to really wonder about that so called "streamer"' .....an its relationship to all this.....


snowman

[Ghost]

snowman - If you care to try SJ again, simply configure the installation to not install JWS.

If for any reason that doesn't work, you can go into Add/Remove Programs and simply un-install it afterwards.

It's not needed at all if all you want is jre 1.4.1

[snowy]

Ghost

appreciated that information....an yes definitely I'll try it again.....this time without the webstart......will do this alittle later in the day when it wont be a problem if the ye ole computer begins to act-up.......

much ..much..thank you

snowman