June 18th - major announcement from Microsoft!

[guest]

Microsoft planning major announcement for June 18th (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-planning-major-announcement-for-june-18th)

-{ Quote: "Microsoft has just sent out an invitation to an event and to use their terms, "This will be a major Microsoft announcement – you will not want to miss it.". While the details are slim at this point, Microsoft certainly has something major to announce on June 18th.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-planning-major-announcement-for-june-18th" }-


Nokia dropping teasers for same day as Microsoft's big announcement (http://www.neowin.net/news/nokia-dropping-teasers-for-same-day-as-microsofts-big-announcement)

-{ Quote: "Microsoft has quickly thrown together a media event for Monday (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-planning-major-announcement-for-june-18th) and the tech community has been furiously trying to figure out what the company is going to announce. While we still do not have any strong evidence as to what exactly that announcement will be, Nokia is now dropping teaser images for the same date as Microsoft's announcement.

Read more/View the teasers: http://www.neowin.net/news/nokia-dropping-teasers-for-same-day-as-microsofts-big-announcement" }-

[allizomeniz]

I hate when companies do this. The reality never matches the hype. Just announce the stupid thing, whatever it is. when the time comes.

[guest]

Rumors!

On Monday Microsoft will maybe announce a tablet (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/on-monday-microsoft-will-maybe-announce-a-tablet/)

-{ Quote: "On Monday at 3:30pm pacific time Microsoft will unveil something that "you will not want to miss," the company says. Our senior Microsoft editor Peter Bright will be in LA giving you the juicy details, but All Things D and The Wrap seem to have all but confirmed that the announcement will be a new tablet.

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/on-monday-microsoft-will-maybe-announce-a-tablet/" }-

[moontan]

-{ Quote: "June 18th - major announcement from Microsoft! " }-
-{ Quote: "On Monday Microsoft will maybe announce a tablet" }-

ah!

i thought they were gonna announce a killswitch for Metro. lol

[Hungry Man]

Yeah, I heard 'tablet' as well.

[iammike]

Maybe they are going to announce Windows 9 ;)

Also heard that they are going to announce a Tablet for use with Win 8 / Metro. As a lot of people will skip this version because of the missing Start Menu.

Metro is perfect for tablets but not really for desktops.

[guest]

Skipping Windows 8 because of a missing start menu? lol. People can always use Start8 for free.

See: http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

[iammike]

Aren't MS going to remove all legacy code for the start menu from the Definitive Version ?

http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windows8/windows-server-2012-visual-studio-2012-release-preview-143397?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

-{ Quote: "But the software giant has had a change of heart, and my sources at Microsoft tell me it’s been busy ripping out legacy code for the old Start button and Start Menu so that developers won’t be able to write utilities that bring those features back. And boot to the desktop? Forget about it. " }-

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Aren't MS going to remove all legacy code for the start menu from the Definitive Version ?" }-

Where you saw Microsoft stating that?

BTW Start8 (http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/) is a bit different from older Start Menus.

[iammike]

Sorry edited my post after your reply with the quote and source to the article.

[guest]

He doesn't work for Microsoft. :D

[Hungry Man]

Would you like to bet on the capability?

[Noob]

-{ Quote: "Aren't MS going to remove all legacy code for the start menu from the Definitive Version ?

http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windows8/windows-server-2012-visual-studio-2012-release-preview-143397?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter" }-
Woah i just hope this isn't true. If it really turns out like that, then i have no sympathy for Microsoft and hope their W8 is a major FAIL. So bad that they will have to patch it back in a short time or do a major redesign. ;D

[zapjb]

My guess is MS buying Nokia. Or at least some further entanglement between the two.

[tgell]

If they charge a premium price so as not to compete with the OEM makers of other tablets, I think it will be a fail just like all their other hardware projects like Zune, Kin, and their branded routers.

http://tabtimes.com/news/ittech-os-windows/2012/06/15/microsoft-big-windows-8-rt-tablet-balancing-act

[funkydude]

-{ Quote: "If they charge a premium price so as not to compete with the OEM makers of other tablets, I think it will be a fail just like all their other hardware projects like Zune, Kin, and their branded routers.

http://tabtimes.com/news/ittech-os-windows/2012/06/15/microsoft-big-windows-8-rt-tablet-balancing-act" }-

Assuming it even is a tablet, what would be the point of going through the effort of making their own and then not making it a viable purchase with a high price tag?

[tgell]

I don't know. Microsoft would be between a rock and a hard place. If they come out with a really competitive tablet price and feature wise, then they would just be ~ Snipped as per TOS (https://www.wilderssecurity.com/faq.php?faq=wilders_tos#faq_wilders_tos_1) ~ their OEM's. Guess we will see what it is Monday.

Edit: I don't like it but that is one of the advantages Apple has. They control the hardware and software.

[guest]

Another Nokia teaser for Monday, June 18th pops up (http://www.neowin.net/news/another-nokia-teaser-for-monday-june-18th-pops-up)

-{ Quote: "After posting two teaser images late on Friday (http://www.neowin.net/news/nokia-dropping-teasers-for-same-day-as-microsofts-big-announcement), Nokia's U.S. Facebook page just posted up yet another image (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=384977931549858&set=a.109142489133405.4548.100686616645659&type=1) this morning that teases some kind of special event that's happening on Monday, June 18th. This time the image has the date along with an image of three circles that look something like targets that are intersecting each other against against a blue background.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/another-nokia-teaser-for-monday-june-18th-pops-up" }-

[guest]

Microsoft wins, we have no clue what they are announcing (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-wins-we-have-no-clue-what-they-are-announcing)

-{ Quote: "Alright Microsoft, you win. For the first time in many years, Microsoft has thrown together a conference where it seems that we don’t have a clue what Microsoft is going to announce. Rumors have been everywhere, from a Hulu linkup, an Xbox tablet, a Nokia tablet, a Barnes and Noble tablet, Xbox Music service details, a free pony for all Windows Phone users, really, we have no clue.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-wins-we-have-no-clue-what-they-are-announcing" }-

[NGRhodes]

If I was to guess it would be the annoucement of Windows Phone 8 based on the fact we have heard so little about it and Microsoft has kept the topic of this annoucement also quiet.

Other new stuff, Win 8 and Win RT has been less secretive and plans have been discussed so no need to be so secretive about announcements.

Now I wonder if they will announce the future of WP7 devices (if they are upgradable to WP8) ?

Cheers, Nick

[moontan]

-{ Quote: "Microsoft wins, we have no clue what they are announcing (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-wins-we-have-no-clue-what-they-are-announcing)" }-

do we care? ;)

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "do we care? ;)" }-

Not really. ;)

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "do we care? ;)" }-
^ This should be a poll... :)

[funkydude]

The Verge liveblog:

12:30PM - Hawaii
02:30PM - Alaska
03:30PM - Pacific
04:30PM - Mountain
05:30PM - Central
06:30PM - Eastern
07:30PM - São Paulo
11:30PM - London
12:30AM - Paris (June 19th)
02:30AM - Moscow (June 19th)
07:30AM - Tokyo (June 19th)
08:30AM - Sydney (June 19th)

http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/17/3093335/microsoft-major-announcement-event-live-blog

[guest]

Mysterious Microsoft press event to be held at LA's Milk Studios (http://www.neowin.net/news/mysterious-microsoft-press-event-to-be-held-at-la039s-milk-studios)

-{ Quote: "We still don't really know what's going to be show at Microsoft's mysterious and last minute press event later today but we now know where in Los Angeles it will be held. We received an email that Microsoft will hold its media event at Milk Studios. It is described as a "premiere, full service photography studio."

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/mysterious-microsoft-press-event-to-be-held-at-la039s-milk-studios" }-

[Baserk]

The studio luckily offers enough room for all the ponies.
Can find any solid info besides rumours and more speculation;

'Sources tell me that a new tablet will be announced on Monday with Barnes and Noble. The two companies announced a “strategic partnership” in late April with Microsoft investing $300M into the joint business dubbed “Newco” for a 17.6% equity stake and Barnes and Noble owning 82.4%.
The event would be the first public showing of what the two have been working on and may answer the question of why the invite was so bare – because they haven’t announced anything yet and the joint operation has yet to be named. Another source says the tablet may be the first non-Xbox device to gain Xbox Live streaming capabilities, which might explain the location of the event.' link (http://techcrunch.com/2012/06/17/ms-la/)

[funkydude]

The actual liveblog page: http://live.theverge.com/microsoft-live-blog-tablet-announcement/
(not sure why they stuck 'tablet announcement' in the URL as it may not be one but oh well)

I've yet to hear of any livestream unfortunately, 10 minutes left though.

[funkydude]

Neowin's blog has started already, looks like a very nice day :)

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-mystery-event-unveiled

[Noob]

Let's see what is the hype about. ;D

[funkydude]

Impressive...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpzu3HM2CIo&hd=1

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Watch the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpzu3HM2CIo&hd=1" }-

'Microsoft Surface' Windows 8/RT tablets announced (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-based-windows-tablet-announced)

-{ Quote: "The rumors are indeed true. Microsoft is getting into the tablet business with Microsoft Surface type tablet. The product, announced at the company's mysterious Los Angeles press event by the company's CEO Steve Ballmer, will be based on Windows 8.

The press event also revealed that it will have a 10.6 inch display. It weighs just 1.5 pounds, is 9.3 mm think, and is supposedly the first such device with a magnesium case; it will also come with a kickstand. Microsoft will also release a cover for the tablet that will have a keyboard. Inside it will have a ARM-based processor made by NVIDIA and the pro version of Microsoft Surface will have Intel-based processors.

Microsoft has just launched a Microsoft Surface website (http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx) with some more information along with some more images.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-based-windows-tablet-announced" }-


Microsoft surface tablet on video, complete with dubstep (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-tablet-on-video-complete-with-dubstep)

-{ Quote: "Microsoft's event today was certainly surprising, and the devices they showed off were incredible. Now, you can see the Microsoft Surface tablet close up, complete with dubstep and fast-cutting shots.

See more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-tablet-on-video-complete-with-dubstep" }-

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Impressive...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpzu3HM2CIo&hd=1" }-

Indeed. Microsoft has a winner here (Surface)! :thumb:

[guest]

Hands On: Windows RT Surface (http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt)

-{ Quote: "Microsoft just got done unveiling its best kept secret in years and we got a few minutes with the device and came away modestly impressed. We got to play with the RT version of the tablet and it feels like it was carved from a rock. All around, it was sturdy, showed little flex in the casing, and was simply a rock solid piece of hardware. A nice little touch is that if you attach a blue Touch Cover to the device, it will change the theme to match the cover. Additionally, the kickstand was magnificent and did not feel flimsy by any means. Microsoft also went all out by dropping a little bit of water on to the tablet. As you might expect, the water balled up and rolled right off. Microsoft said that it will handle grubby fingers with ease and apparently even tested it with ketchup and mustard.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt" }-


Microsoft Surface RT tablet appears to have 1366x768 display (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-rt-tablet-appears-to-have-1366x768-display)

-{ Quote: "The Surface tablet by Microsoft is one of the most incredible devices Microsoft has created, and they were quick to tout the new innovations onboard. However, the company was incredibly coy about specifics on some specifications such as battery life and screen resolution. A PDF posted by Microsoft (http://www.microsoft.com/global/surface/en/us/renderingassets/surfacespecsheet.pdf) notes that the resolution is "HD" for the Windows RT (ARM) model, and "Full HD" for the Windows 8 Pro model. Unfortunately, "HD" doesn't actually translate well, and actually means the device is likely to end up with a 1366x768 display at 10 inches for the Windows RT edition. On the other side of the fence, Apple's "new iPad" features a 2048-by-1536 display at just 9 inches. The notable comparison here is price wise, the new iPad and the Windows Surface RT are in the same ballpark.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-rt-tablet-appears-to-have-1366x768-display" }-


Microsoft Surface for Windows RT features a Nvidia Tegra processor (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-for-windows-rt-features-a-nvidia-tegra-processor)

-{ Quote: "Good news! The Windows RT version of the Microsoft Surface tablet will feature no less than the latest and greatest Nvidia Tegra chip, according to The Verge (http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/18/3095909/microsoft-surface-windows-rt-nvidia-tegra). Nvidia sent around a short note today touting the new devices' internals, and they aren't disappointing by any measure. All bets are on the Tegra 3+ that Nvidia confirmed is coming to Windows 8 (http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/6/3067089/nvidia-promises-10-hours-battery-life-for-windows-rt-no-fans-or-vents) being what's at the Surface's heart, but we'll know soon enough.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-for-windows-rt-features-a-nvidia-tegra-processor" }-

[guest]

Microsoft announces Type and Touch Covers (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/)

-{ Quote: "...Microsoft's Touch Cover for the Surface tablets is 3mm thick and comes in four available colors: Cyan, Orange, Magenta, and Grey. The real trick is that it doubles as a keyboard and trackpad, both on the inside of the cover. The Surface tablet can recognize when the cover is attached and users can't miss when trying to connect through its use of magnets. The cover comes with an accelerometer, so it can measure the force of each finger. This allows the users to both rest hands on the computer and type with the hardware distinguishing between the actions. Microsoft claimed typing is twice as efficient here as opposed to glass, and that the keyboard samples 10x faster than any actual keyboard. The Surface OS can recognize when its folded behind the back of the tablet (indicating the keyboard should be switched off). Microsoft touted 30 years of mouse technology and 15 years of keyboards went into this design. For users who are uncomfortable with virtual keys, there's the Type Cover. It connects to the Surface in the same way, but provides a tactile keyboard with touchpad...

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/" }-

[vasa1]

Let's see how things go. I got the impression that Apple's margins on the iPad are pretty high. If they feel threatened, slashing prices will be good for customers.

[guest]

Sincerely, the latest iPad can't compete with the technology of this "beast" built by Microsoft. Surface is an astonishing device, superior in every way. Compared to it, the iPad looks dated, dumb and extremely fragile. IMO Apple needs to come up with something new and better as soon as possible - but the problem is, Apple already announced their new devices for this year! So, right now, things are starting to smell badly for Apple. The several upcoming models of Windows 8/RT powered devices from other big names of the industry basically won't give the right for Apple to set any price advantage too.

As a side note, take a look at that video made by Microsoft. It's nothing short of amazing. Looks like Microsoft finally has a marketing department that's able to compete with/outperform Apple's. I'm truly impressed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpzu3HM2CIo&hd=1

[vasa1]

A walk down memory lane: http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/for-microsoft-promise-of-tablets-has-always-been-greater-than-reality/2012/06/19/gJQAx2eAnV_story.html

SB looks really tense ???

[guest]

-{ Quote: "A walk down memory lane: http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/for-microsoft-promise-of-tablets-has-always-been-greater-than-reality/2012/06/19/gJQAx2eAnV_story.html

SB looks really tense ???" }-

Are you sure you're seeing the same photo as me? I never saw him so calm and relaxed. Look at his eyes and eyebrows.

He clearly has a winner in his hands. :)

[NGRhodes]

Microsoft has made a few good design decisions towards productivity - the integrated keyboard/touchpad and the built in stand, will really help bridge the gap between current tablets and laptops (esp Ultrabooks), which are still the preference for content creation amongst office workers.

They just need to get these devices to market quick to take advantage of the oppertunity they have to make an impression in the tablet market.

Cheers, Nick

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Microsoft has made a few good design decisions towards productivity - the integrated keyboard/touchpad and the built in stand, will really help bridge the gap between current tablets and laptops (esp Ultrabooks), which are still the preference for content creation amongst office workers." }-

True. The kickstand and the Type and Touch Covers are amazing. Other impressive unique aspects are the magnesium case (world's first) which was shown to be very resistant. And the Gorilla Glass! And magnets! And superior technical aspects in every way (especially the Pro version). This is a device I'm really looking forward to buy.

-{ Quote: "They just need to get these devices to market quick to take advantage of the oppertunity they have to make an impression in the tablet market.

Cheers, Nick" }-

Agreed.

[aigle]

I got iPad 2 for my wife and never liked iOS.

While using it( and the iPhone) I always felt myself tied with ropes. I could not even straightaway download and save things via the browser. Android was different in this respect so I liked it( though it,s UI is far less polished than iOS).

Now I think that a windows tablet will be superior to both. Actually I had already planned to get one instead of a new laptop but I was thinking of an Ausus transformer with Windows 8 but now I doubt if Asus can come out with some thing superior to MS Surface.

I am having a close eye on windows phone too. Wish they make windows phone 8 just similar to Windows RT tablets.

I will wish some things to be added though:

- retina display
- thunderbolt ports
- an extremely good battery life( at least identical to iPad or Asus Transformer prime)

My guess is that MS Surface might destroy android tablets very soon and will alsochallenge iPad,s dominance after some time.

Only way for Google to fight it will be to polish Android more and more up to the level of iOS, to support peripherals like printers etc on android tablets and to tightly control android apps to get quality apps in their app market and avoiding crappy apps.

[vasa1]

Watching this -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCmudUDv3GA-. Pretty impressive.

Edit: "every micron matters" (~ 36:33) should be the pitch!

[aigle]

I wish they could kept the Surface pro tablet,s thickness and weight just equal to the ARM one( while making ARM one more lighter and thinner, just like Transformer prime pro or toshiba tablet).

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Watching this -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCmudUDv3GA-. Pretty impressive.

Edit: "every micron matters" (~ 36:33) should be the pitch!" }-

I like it. 8)

[funkydude]

-{ Quote: "I wish they could kept the Surface pro tablet,s thickness and weight just equal to the ARM one( while making ARM one more lighter and thinner, just like Transformer prime pro or toshiba tablet)." }-

How do you propose they do that when the chipset itself is critically different? It's an x86 tablet not an ARM tablet like the transformer. It will be able to run desktop apps like games, it has to be beefier.

I could see myself replacing my laptop with one when we hear more about pricing and performance. But that's the whole point of the product, to be a laptop and a tablet.

[vasa1]

-{ Quote: "Watching this -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCmudUDv3GA-. Pretty impressive.

Edit: "every micron matters" (~ 36:33) should be the pitch!" }-
A side issue was the fluency of the three speakers. No irritating humming and hawing and searching for words. The guy who moderated the Linus session (-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MShbP3OpASA&feature=relmfu-) was quite irritating even though he had notes!

[InfinityAz]

They look interesting but it's way too early to tell, especially since no one outside of Microsoft was able to use a working version (i.e., from the comments I read, the people who attended the event were not able to use a working version, keyboard, get that close to working models, etc.).

Anyway, since this is a security forum, my question is will we need/have to run anti-malware software on these devices?

[guest]

They were able to use working versions. And the native OS is Windows 8/RT which comes with an improved version of Windows Defender with full anti-malware capabilities (= Microsoft Security Essentials) and other security improvements like system-wide SmartScreen.

[moontan]

hopefully for Microsoft that new tablet thingie fares better than their ill fated attempt with the Touch Mouse for Windows 7. ;)

[vasa1]

It's getting a mixed reception, given that so much is still unknown:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/06/19/microsoft_surface_tablet1/
http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9228223/Microsoft_own_worst_enemy_in_bold_tablet_move_says_analyst

[InfinityAz]

-{ Quote: "They were able to use working versions. And the native OS is Windows 8/RT which comes with an improved version of Windows Defender with full anti-malware capabilities (= Microsoft Security Essentials) and other security improvements like system-wide SmartScreen." }-
Thanks guest, forgot all about the new Windows Defender. Regarding the working versions, I'm not sure but based on what I read at pcmag, pcworld, anandtech, et al:
"Microsoft didn't really allow reporters any hands-on time at its launch Monday afternoon in Hollywood. Instead, analysts and reporters were granted just a few seconds - quite literally - before being ushered away. Several more tablets were apparently powered on and functioning, but walled off by the red velvet rope that's so common in Hollywood."

So maybe some people did get hands-on time. Anyway, looking forward to seeing how this develops and impacts the market.

[guest]

A first look at Microsoft's new Surface tablet (http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/a-first-look-and-feel-of-microsofts-first-pc/)

-{ Quote: "Microsoft has unveiled (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/liveblog-from-la-microsofts-major-announcement-rumored-tablet-unveil/) Surface: a pair of tablet PCs (http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/microsoft-unveils-surface-tablet-powered-by-windows-8/) and a pair of covers-cum-keyboards (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/), designed for, and designed around, its Windows 8 operating system. Microsoft's intent with the Surface tablets is to create hardware that puts the software front and center, to provide the hardware necessary to allow Windows 8's strengths to really come to the foreground. At the launch event, however, the software took the back seat. This was all about the hardware, and with good reason. The Surface tablets are smart, good-looking, carefully considered, well built, slick pieces of kit, and there's nothing even close on the market today. Of course, they're not on the market today either, but unless the PC OEMs inject a serious dose of quality in their their build and design processes, the Surface units will stand alone when they eventually go on sale.

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/a-first-look-and-feel-of-microsofts-first-pc/" }-


What we know (and don't know) about Microsoft's Surface (http://www.neowin.net/news/what-we-know-and-dont-know-about-microsofts-surface)

-{ Quote: "At yesterdays mystery Microsoft event, the company unveiled the Microsoft Surface range to a stunned audience. The Microsoft-made tablets are the benchmark for high-end tablet design and come with beautiful hardware to complement all the work Microsoft has put in to making the software - Windows RT or Windows 8 Pro, depending on the tablet - just right for the form factor. However while a lot was revealed at today's event, a lot of critical information was missing from the procession at today's event. So, to make it easier for everyone searching for info on the tablet we have compiled a list of things we know, things that are possibilities and things we don't know about the Microsoft Surface.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/what-we-know-and-dont-know-about-microsofts-surface" }-

[guest]

-{ Quote: "So maybe some people did get hands-on time. Anyway, looking forward to seeing how this develops and impacts the market." }-

Yes, as I quoted in page 2, some people did get hands-on time: http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt

The gallery of photos of the article clearly shows reporters playing with Surfaces.

Examples:
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet%208.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet7.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet6.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet9.jpg

[guest]

Ballmer: PC makers were aware of Surface before reveal (http://www.neowin.net/news/ballmer-pc-makers-were-aware-of-surface-before-reveal)

-{ Quote: "With the reveal of the Surface Windows 8/RT based tablet (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-mystery-event-unveiled) on Monday, this also means that Microsoft is entering the PC hardware business directly for the first time. So, one of the big questions surrounding the Surface announcement was, "How will other PC makers react to this reveal?" In a brief chat with The Verge (http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/18/3095910/steve-ballmer-on-microsoft-surface-we-want-to-prime-the-pump), Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer said that other PC hardware makers were made aware ahead of time that Microsoft was going to reveal the Surface tablet. However, he didn't say what their reaction was to this new move by Microsoft, saying simply that they might "opine" on Microsoft's decision.

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/ballmer-pc-makers-were-aware-of-surface-before-reveal" }-

[guest]

Another hands-on review:

Hands on: Microsoft Surface tablet review (http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/tablets/microsoft-surface-tablet-1085839/review)

-{ Quote: "Magnesium chassis, vapour deposition coating, cutaway edges, ClearType HD display; the design credentials and the specs for Microsoft's new Windows RT tablet are impressive and in the flesh this is a delightful piece of hardware that looks good – and is practical too. It's thin, it's light, it's comfortable to hold, it runs Windows RT as excellently as you'd expect, it makes you want to touch it but it's also designed so you can snap the magnetically attached cover into place – in no way similar to any competitor idea...

Read more: http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/tablets/microsoft-surface-tablet-1085839/review" }-

[aigle]

-{ Quote: "How do you propose they do that when the chipset itself is critically different? It's an x86 tablet not an ARM tablet like the transformer. It will be able to run desktop apps like games, it has to be beefier.

I could see myself replacing my laptop with one when we hear more about pricing and performance. But that's the whole point of the product, to be a laptop and a tablet." }-
Don't forget Intel medfield processor that is x86 and Intel wants to compete with ARM with it.

[Noob]

Just another tablet for me. . . ::)

[Kerodo]

If they ever get 'em to the point where I can do everything I need, then maybe I'll buy one....

[vasa1]

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9228247/Microsoft_s_Surface_tablet_no_threat_to_Apple_s_iPad

If true, Apple won't slash prices :(

[tgell]

-{ Quote: "http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9228247/Microsoft_s_Surface_tablet_no_threat_to_Apple_s_iPad

If true, Apple won't slash prices :(" }-

Microsoft may be willing to sell at a loss in order to get market share. They sold the X-box at a loss for quite awhile. They have plenty of cash on hand that they could do this forever but this causes a problem of Microsoft eating into their OEM tablet makers like HP and Dell. By not having control over the hardware and software like Apple, Microsoft is stuck between a rock and a hard place. Does Microsoft sell at a loss and make their OEM's mad or sell at a premium price hoping it will beat Apple on features? Only time will tell.

[SweX]

I think that much will depend on how well the OS will work on a tablet.
And to me it's not really a tablet, it's more like a Tab-Lap.

[guest]

UK's Carphone Warehouse: Microsoft Surface is "exciting" (http://www.neowin.net/news/uks-carphone-warehouse-microsoft-surface-is-exciting)

-{ Quote: "So far, Microsoft has said that its newly revealed Surface tablet (http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-surface-based-windows-tablet-announced) will be sold on its Microsoft Store website and in its retail Microsoft Store locations. So far, it has yet to say what other retailers might be selling the Surface. However, that isn't stopping one UK retailer from expressing their opinions on the Surface.


Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/uks-carphone-warehouse-microsoft-surface-is-exciting" }-

Ballmer's memo to employees is passionate, optimistic (http://www.neowin.net/news/ballmers-memo-to-employees-is-passionate-optimistic)

-{ Quote: "Not long after the announcement of the Microsoft Surface (http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt), Ballmer released an internal memo to light a fire within the company and rally the troops to keep pushing further with their ambitions. The company has released several products over the past few years that have been a huge success and with Surface, Ballmer is ambitious that the trend will continue.
Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/ballmers-memo-to-employees-is-passionate-optimistic" }-


-{ Quote: "Just another tablet for me. . . ::)" }-
You really failed to get the details about Surface then. There's nothing even close on the market today.

-{ Quote: "http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9228247/Microsoft_s_Surface_tablet_no_threat_to_Apple_s_iPad

If true, Apple won't slash prices :(" }-
-{ Quote: "

The anal-ists said the iPad was a solution looking for a problem when it first debuted. Remember all the jokes about the name? The anal-ists also said the Xbox would flop and get buried buy the Playstation. Lesson learned: don't listen to anal-ists and don't underestimate the strength of demand from the corporate IT base. That's why Apple is still sucking wind in the business world. Corporations will not give up control over their hardware to Apple control freaks IMHO." }-

[Page42]

Just a quick comment lobbed from the periphery... it's been entertaining AND educational watching you guys cover this MS announcement. :thumb:

[zapjb]

I think MS pricing will be within 10% of Apple, like for like.

I also think if MS doesn't price at least 25-30% lower than Apple the Surface will fail. Unless it's tied to a cellular contract that involves heavy subsidies.

[guest]

Five unique features which may lead to Surface's success (http://www.neowin.net/news/five-unique-features-which-may-lead-to-surfaces-success)

-{ Quote: "...we thought we’d highlight five features that make this tablet unique when comparing it to formidable competition such as the iPad...

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/five-unique-features-which-may-lead-to-surfaces-success" }-

He didn't mention among those 5 unique features, several other unique and important features, like the super-resistant magnesium case, next generation Gorilla Glass and the use of magnets. Surface is so cool!

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "UK's Carphone Warehouse: Microsoft Surface is "exciting" (http://www.neowin.net/news/uks-carphone-warehouse-microsoft-surface-is-exciting)

" }-

To be fair though, Carphone Warehouse thinks everything is "exciting". Haven't you seen their commercials?

[guest]

-{ Quote: "To be fair though, Carphone Warehouse thinks everything is "exciting". Haven't you seen their commercials?" }-

Never. But they certainly aren't alone in thinking that Surface is exciting. :)

[iammike]

-{ Quote: "Acer founder Stan Shih has commented that Microsoft has no real intention to sell own-brand tablet PCs and the offering is an ploy to boost adoption of Windows 8.
" }-

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20120619PD224.html

Rumors of course but still..

[guest]

Part of the Surface's purpose is to "prime the pump" for the coming release of Windows 8, according to Steve Ballmer.

See: http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/18/3095910/steve-ballmer-on-microsoft-surface-we-want-to-prime-the-pump

[guest]

With the Surface, Microsoft just started writing its next chapter (http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/19/3097726/surface-microsoft-next-chapter)

-{ Quote: "I first met Steven Bathiche when I took a trip to Microsoft's campus to check out what the company had been doing in the research and development department. Microsoft PR had sworn to me that I would be blown away by the "cool things" the company was doing, and I wanted to see for myself (you can watch the results here (http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/28/2665794/microsoft-edison-lab-holodeck-tour/in/2418440), here (http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/27/2663620/microsoft-envisioning-lab-exclusive-tour/in/2418440), and here (http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/20/2650157/microsoft-model-lab-3d-printing-video/in/2418440)).

Stevie's lab was located in a dark corner of one of the many, large buildings within the company's Seattle sprawl. The second I walked inside, it was clear the work happening inside was safely in the realm of mad science. Bathiche showed me a project he's been working on for some time which would allow you to create a virtual window from one room to another, utilizing a variety of display, motion sensing, and 3D technologies. He dubbed it the "magic wall."

It was nuts. It was awesome. It was ambitious.

The whole time, all I could think was: where has Microsoft been hiding guys like this?

After yesterday's announcement of the Surface (http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/18/3095794/microsoft-surface-tablet-event) tablet and its accessories, it seems like the company is ready to bring some of its wild thinkers out of hiding.

Read more: http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/19/3097726/surface-microsoft-next-chapter" }-

[tgell]

I think Microsoft realizes that it had to come out with it's own hardware because it is desperate to take some tablet market share. Even though it may have a superior product to other tablets, if the competition reaches a certain critical mass, Microsoft's foray into tablets is doomed especially if they do not get the pricing right. Kind of like the Betamax vs VHS wars. Even though Betamax was a superior format, VHS had the market share and eventually won. This is going to be an interesting battle, especially since I believe they are throwing all of their desktop users under the bus.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: " ... especially since I believe they are throwing all of their desktop users under the bus." }-

That's some big bus as well. :o

[vasa1]

-{ Quote: "I think Microsoft realizes that it had to come out with it's own hardware because it is desperate to take some tablet market share. ..." }-
And when it is eventually a reality, it may not be widely available. The face-to-face support that people are used to won't be there.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Microsoft's foray into tablets is doomed especially if they do not get the pricing right." }-

Microsoft stated that Surface's prices will be competitive. Here is an unofficial estimate: "ARM-based Surface will probably retail for around $500, while the Pro Surface for around $800-900". Source (http://www.neowin.net/news/what-we-know-and-dont-know-about-microsofts-surface)

-{ Quote: "Kind of like the Betamax vs VHS wars. Even though Betamax was a superior format, VHS had the market share and eventually won. " }-

I can't see the analogy, especially because the Surface has better hardware and software support than any other tablet (including latest iPad) thanks mainly to its native OS (Windows 8/RT) and native USB ports.

-{ Quote: "especially since I believe they are throwing all of their desktop users under the bus." }-

What you mean with that statement?

-{ Quote: "And when it is eventually a reality, it may not be widely available. The face-to-face support that people are used to won't be there." }-

A part of the structure to make it widely available is very visible. Microsoft is already selling hardware all around the world (various models of: XBOX 360 and its accessories, keyboards, mouses, webcams, headsets, gaming peripherals, etc).

[tgell]

-{ Quote: "And when it is eventually a reality, it may not be widely available. The face-to-face support that people are used to won't be there." }-

I read that it will only be available online and in Microsoft stores which there are about 20 now.

[vasa1]

-{ Quote: "I read that it will only be available online and in Microsoft stores which there are about 20 now." }-
My point exactly. So that may reduce chances of being a significant player.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "I read that it will only be available online and in Microsoft stores which there are about 20 now." }-
-{ Quote: "My point exactly. So that may reduce chances of being a significant player." }-

Microsoft didn't detail the international availability of Surface yet. This doesn't mean that Surface "will only be available online and in Microsoft stores", it only means that Microsoft still didn't talk about the availability in detail.

[Noob]

To be honest, i don't think this will really be something successful, they will sell some but not enough at the end and it will end up being a fail project IMO. ;D ;D

[Cudni]

choice comments from people in the industry
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-18503772

[PoetWarrior]

I noticed Paul Thurrott raised some interesting points today:

But what many on-site reports from the day of the launch didn’t care to mention is perhaps the most bizarre bit of all: The Surface tablet doesn’t even exist. It’s vaporware.

The devices that Microsoft showed off earlier this week weren’t real; they were simply prototypes. And anyone claiming to have gotten “hands-on” time with a Surface tablet was exaggerating, at best: No one was allowed to touch a working prototype, so those typing videos occurred on dead pieces of hardware without a working screen.

So that raises the first obvious question: Why did Microsoft suddenly rush to announce this device family? The company didn’t alert the press to Monday’s event until the previous Thursday, giving press and bloggers just days to book expensive last-minute travel to Los Angeles. What was that all about?

http://www.winsupersite.com/article/paul-thurrotts-wininfo/surface-tablet-microsoft-takes-apple-mimics-google-143481

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "To be honest, i don't think this will really be something successful, they will sell some but not enough at the end and it will end up being a fail project IMO. ;D ;D" }-

It looks very clever, but if I had 700 quid on me & I was looking for a laptop/notebook equivalent, I'd probably spend the money on a decent laptop. I won't need to touch the screen & the keyboard folds up with the machine when I close it. ;)

[Baserk]

-{ Quote: "...So that raises the first obvious question: Why did Microsoft suddenly rush to announce this device family? The company didn’t alert the press to Monday’s event until the previous Thursday, giving press and bloggers just days to book expensive last-minute travel to Los Angeles. What was that all about?
" }-
Seems like an effort to stimulate the idea of 'Metro' being a (soon-to-be) established full-spectrum 'OS'; PC/Laptop/Tablet/Phone, giving more credence to the Sinofsky/Metro Win8 overhaul decision.

[PoetWarrior]

I'm wondering if the fiery debate over Windows 8's metro is starting to weigh on the company. I noticed how Ballmer sent out an email praising MS employees and that seemed more like a pep talk to tired troops. Internal divisions inside MS might be widening and deepening. We shall see.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "But what many on-site reports from the day of the launch didn’t care to mention is perhaps the most bizarre bit of all: The Surface tablet doesn’t even exist. It’s vaporware. The devices that Microsoft showed off earlier this week weren’t real; they were simply prototypes. And anyone claiming to have gotten “hands-on” time with a Surface tablet was exaggerating, at best: No one was allowed to touch a working prototype, so those typing videos occurred on dead pieces of hardware without a working screen." }-
Are you joking or spreading FUD intentionally? I already pointed several screenshots of reporters playing with Surfaces. If you missed it:

Examples:
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet%208.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet7.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet6.jpg
- http://www.neowin.net/images/galleries/1497/tablet9.jpg

And search for videos with the keywords "hands-on" "surface"...

Stop denying the reality, dude. It's getting wild.

-{ Quote: "So that raises the first obvious question: Why did Microsoft suddenly rush to announce this device family? The company didn’t alert the press to Monday’s event until the previous Thursday, giving press and bloggers just days to book expensive last-minute travel to Los Angeles. What was that all about?" }-
It was about Surface. Great marketing, great device. Surface is real. I know, the truth hurts, and such a winner product certainly hurts your deep anti-Microsoft sentiments. But to deny its very existence? WOW, you went FAR!

-{ Quote: "I'm wondering if the fiery debate over Windows 8's metro is starting to weigh on the company. I noticed how Ballmer sent out an email praising MS employees and that seemed more like a pep talk to tired troops. Internal divisions inside MS might be widening and deepening. We shall see." }-
Yes, yes, ~Comment removed~ Thank you very much.

[Lou Knee]

Surface: Why Microsoft's big mystery turns out to be a big mistake

Quote from linked article -

"When I do my end-of-year “tech flops” round-up, I fully expect Surface tablets to make the list."

www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/surface-why-microsofts-big-mystery-turns-out-to-be-a-big-mistake/20857

IMO A rushed Vaporware announcement, to detract from the stench of FAIL that is slowly building on the carcass of Win8.

[ronjor]

Let's keep the personal attacks out of the threads on this forum.

[PoetWarrior]

Paul Thurrott is the source for this information. If you have a problem with it take it up with him and try a little less angst. ::)

[guest]

Just more anti-Metro rants - now from June 7, 2012 (FYI, that was 2 weeks ago).

Surface wasn't even mentioned in the article from a blogger of Zdnet that you quoted.

*

Vaporware isn't lack of some information about a product that will be released soon. Vaporware is a term in the computer industry that describes a product, typically computer hardware or software, that is announced to the general public but is never actually released nor officially canceled.

[guest]

Global economy, global economy... such comments are empty of meaning IMO. PC worldwide sales didn't slow down even in the worst moments of the over-hyped "crisis". There is no reason to believe such sales will slow down now that the biggest economies are recovering and growing again.

[moontan]

-{ Quote: "Global economy, global economy... such comments are empty of meaning IMO. PC worldwide sales didn't slow down even in the worst moments of the over-hyped "crisis". There is no reason to believe such sales will slow down now that the biggest economies are recovering and growing again." }-

well, i'm sure most people are more concerned these days about filling the gas tank than buying another consumer appliance.

the situation in Europe at the moment is not very good, if you been watching the news.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "well, i'm sure most people are more concerned these days about filling the gas tank than buying another consumer appliance." }-

Is that influencing in worldwide PC sales? Is it slowing down? I don't think so: the numbers continue to grow year after year (albeit you could argue that they would be growing more if it wasn't for the crisis, and I agree - but that's irrelevant for this discussion IMO).

-{ Quote: "the situation in Europe at the moment is not very good, if you been watching the news." }-

The situation in some European countries isn't good (Greece, Italy and Spain, I think). But Europe is comprised of approximately 50 countries..

[moontan]

we'll all know within a few months for sure.

anyway, back to the tablet... ;)

[guest]

Pages 2 and 3 of this thread are full of info about Surface.

I want it asap, the Pro version of course, although the ARM-based looks exciting too.

I can't wait to say bye bye to my HP dv7-4069wm. These units of HP are presenting severe hardware issues.

[moontan]

-{ Quote: "Pages 2 and 3 of this thread are full of info about Surface.

I want it asap, the Pro version of course, although the ARM-based looks exciting too.

I can't wait to say bye bye to my HP dv7-4069wm. These units are presenting severe hardware issues." }-

my guess is probably ready for the holiday shopping season, since they haven't released any ETA

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: " PC worldwide sales didn't slow down even in the worst moments of the over-hyped "crisis". " }-

Do you have any (unbiased) figures for this? I am seeing small independent computer shops/stores closing down in my country & we aren't even in the euro.

-{ Quote: "There is no reason to believe such sales will slow down now that the biggest economies are recovering and growing again." }-

Really? Which economies are these? China? Japan? Germany, Greece? I doubt MS will sell much of anything new in Europe.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "But Europe is comprised of approximately 50 countries.." }-

And how many of those are in Eastern Europe and are poorer than Greece?

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Never. But they certainly aren't alone in thinking that Surface is exciting. :)" }-

I used to think Top of the Pops was exciting. I'm not particularly excited by Surface. In the present economic climate, I can't see Carphone Warehouse shifting many of these.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Do you have any (unbiased) figures for this? I am seeing small independent computer shops/stores closing down in my country & we aren't even in the euro." }-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_share_of_leading_PC_vendors#Unit_Sales

-{ Quote: "Really? Which economies are these? China? Japan? Germany, Greece? I doubt MS will sell much of anything new in Europe." }-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_real_GDP_growth_rate_%28latest_year%29

-{ Quote: "And how many of those are in Eastern Europe and are poorer than Greece?" }-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union#Economic_growth
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GNI_(nominal)_per_capita

-{ Quote: "I used to think Top of the Pops was exciting. I'm not particularly excited by Surface. In the present economic climate, I can't see Carphone Warehouse shifting many of these." }-

We don't even know if Carphone Warehouse will sell Surfaces. I'm excited with Surface because of its tech aspects: it is a great device with unique features, it's bringing several innovations to the market. I see potential in Surface for a big success in terms of sales (it's a natural winner), but I don't really care about Surface in such "economic terms" - I'm not a shareholder of MSFT.

[vasa1]

Pegatron (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/06/20/pegatron_microsoft_surface/)

[Cudni]

ot posts removed. see also
www.wilderssecurity.com/showpost.php?p=2075058&postcount=86

[Noob]

-{ Quote: "It looks very clever, but if I had 700 quid on me & I was looking for a laptop/notebook equivalent, I'd probably spend the money on a decent laptop. I won't need to touch the screen & the keyboard folds up with the machine when I close it. ;)" }-

Yeah, at least for me, i see nothing impressive in this, it's just another tablet but with a Desktop OS. I really do not see much appeal for the general masses (Where the money is i guess). ;D
If i gave the option to my friends/relatives of a free iPad or this new Surface i'm 100% sure they will all choose the iPad without a doubt. ;D

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Yeah, at least for me, i see nothing impressive in this, it's just another tablet but with a Desktop OS. I really do not see much appeal for the general masses (Where the money is i guess). ;D " }-

I really can't understand your opinion. Did you read the specs and the details about Surface? For instance, read this small comparative:

- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/19/surface-ipad-tablet_n_1610331.html

And this:

- http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/Microsoft-Surface-vs-iPad-10-Reasons-to-Ditch-Apples-Tablet-556394/

From a technological POV, there is nothing even close to Surface in the market. It simply beats them all.

-{ Quote: "If i gave the option to my friends/relatives of a free iPad or this new Surface i'm 100% sure they will all choose the iPad without a doubt. ;D" }-

Most of them probably don't even know what Surface is (if they aren't tech savvy). Show them the specs, tell them the details about each one, and then you will see very different results, I'm sure (unless they are blind apple zombies/fanboys, of course).

[guest]

Noob, look how positive Surface's first reception was: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpzu3HM2CIo&hd=1

[tgell]

The Future Of Microsoft Is Sunny With A Chance Of Thunderstorms

-{ Quote: "The past few years haven’t been kind to Microsoft. (There’s no need to walk down memory lane. We all know what’s happened.) But somehow that’s all changed in the past few days. Surface and Windows Phone 8, along with Windows 8 and Xbox prove there’s still some fight left in the old dog. It’s a bit premature to say that the company is back and that the decades long string of mediocrity coming out of Redmond is over but the company is clearly focused and we haven’t seen that Microsoft in a long, long time." }-

I thought this was a rather fair article. Where Microsoft shot themselves in the foot was saying the Lumia would not be able to upgrade to Windows Phone 8. That is like an instant death sentence for sales. Why buy now when you can wait a few months.

Article (http://techcrunch.com/2012/06/20/the-future-of-microsoft-is-sunny-with-a-chance-of-thunderstorms/)

[guest]

Wikipedia article - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29

-{ Quote: "
...

Hardware

The Microsoft Surface line features VaporMg, pronounced "VaporMag", the molded magnesium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium) casing[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-5) that houses Surface's components paired with a PVD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_vapor_deposition) finish, which is a manufacturing process that produces a durable finish.[7] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-6) VaporMg allows magnesium to be melted down and molded to the details needed for Surface and allows Surface to weigh 1.5 pounds. Also included in both Surface models is a USB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB) port, a micro-SD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micro-SD) slot, and a magnetic strip to attach accessories such as the 'Touch Cover' and 'Type Cover'. There are also two cameras, front-facing and rear-facing.[8] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-7) The rear-facing camera will be angled at 22 degrees to allow proper framing of another person while the "kickstand" is in use. The "kickstand" is a .77 mm thin built-in stand that spans the width of the device and allows Surface to be propped up at an angle in landscape orientation for a hands-free viewing experience. Surface Pro has perimeter venting which allows air to flow out the sides, and helps avoid airflow being impeded by hands holding the device.
For the CPUs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CPU), the Surface with Windows RT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_RT) will use a Nvidia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia) Tegra (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegra) CPU.[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-rt-cpu-0) The Surface Pro, running full Windows 8 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8), will utilize an "Ivy Bridge" Core i5 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_i5) quad core chip, which is comparable to chips in current Windows laptops.[9] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-8)
The Surface device demoed in the Microsoft Surface Events had a new connection port with five pins. This was acknowledged as a magnetic charging connector during Microsoft’s presentation event by Steven Sinofsky (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Sinofsky).[10] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-9)

Display

Surface and Surface Pro both have screens of 10.6" with a 16:9 aspect ratio, with the Pro version having a resolution of 1920×1080 and the RT version having a resolution of 1366×768. Both tablets use Microsoft's ClearType HD display technology and support an ultra-wide viewing angle and auto-adjusting screen intensity.[11] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-10)[12] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-11) Surface has an HD Display and Surface Pro has a Full HD Display. In announcement talk, Michael Angiulo said that when Surface Pro is held at 17", the eyes will not be able to distinguish between individual pixels.[13] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-12)

Touch Cover and Type Cover

Microsoft will offer two keyboard covers for Surface: Touch Cover and Type Cover. Both, when folded up, serve as protective covers that connect to the Surface via a magnetic strip. When opened, the covers are keyboards. The Touch Cover is 3 mm in thickness and has a touch-sensitive keyboard. The Type Cover is thicker and includes a tactile keyboard. The keyboards have gyroscope and accelerometer sensors to determine, based on position, whether or not to accept input. Both also include a multitouch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multitouch) touchpad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touchpad).[14] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-13)

Availability

No shipping/availability date has been announced.[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-14) The Surface for Windows RT will be available with general availability of Windows 8 and Surface Pro will be available three months after that.[16] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-ms-pr-15) The Surface will initially be available in Microsoft Stores and online.[16] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-ms-pr-15)

Pricing

Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer stated at the LA conference that "suggested retail pricing will be announced closer to availability and is expected to be competitive with a comparable ARM tablet or Intel Ultrabook-class PC. OEMs will have cost and feature parity on Windows 8 Pro and Windows RT."[17] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Surface_%28tablet%29#cite_note-16)

...
" }-

[Baserk]

A more precise price than Ultrabookish would be nice. And another minor detail for a portable device; battery time.
It looks fair though, kudos for MS reg. design. But IE better work..:P

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_share_of_leading_PC_vendors#Unit_Sales" }-

Well, it's 2012 now, those figures end at 2010. A lot's happened economically in Europe since 2010. Unemployment is as high as the Great Depression. Some European countries are virtually bankrupt. I don't know who's buying all these computers.


-{ Quote: "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_real_GDP_growth_rate_%28latest_year%29" }-

These 'statistics' mean nothing really though do they? Or am I imagining the recession in Europe?

-{ Quote: "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union#Economic_growth
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GNI_(nominal)_per_capita" }-

Remind me to quote these figures to my next door neighbours who are now unemployed due to redundancy. I have personally seen two colleges of further education close due to lack of funding. I know, because I was one of the lecturers made redundant.


-{ Quote: "We don't even know if Carphone Warehouse will sell Surfaces. I'm excited with Surface because of its tech aspects: it is a great device with unique features, it's bringing several innovations to the market. I see potential in Surface for a big success in terms of sales (it's a natural winner), but I don't really care about Surface in such "economic terms" - I'm not a shareholder of MSFT." }-

I'm not excited about Surface. I don't like tablets. They may sell millions of units. I won't be a customer. It's whatever floats your boat I suppose. You can quote from Wackopedia as much as you like, it doesn't change the fact that many European economies are flat-lining. Have you ever visited any Eastern European countries? They weren't doing all that well before the recent recession. I've lost count of the Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, Ukrainians & other nationalities who I have taught English to, & who came to my country before the recent collapse of the euro, because they couldn't find work in their own countries. Most of them were highly skilled. At least a dozen were doctors.

I just don't see who is going to run out to spend several hundred quid on a tablet computer, in an economic climate, where many are having difficulty just paying rent.

Microsoft have misjudged their timing with this release IMO.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Yeah, at least for me, i see nothing impressive in this, it's just another tablet but with a Desktop OS. I really do not see much appeal for the general masses (Where the money is i guess). ;D
If i gave the option to my friends/relatives of a free iPad or this new Surface i'm 100% sure they will all choose the iPad without a doubt. ;D" }-

Yeah, I can't see it outselling the iPad. Mind you, I predicted the Spice Girls wouldn't sell any records, so I can't speak much for my crystal ball!

I'd still rather buy a decent laptop than a tablet.

[guest]

I won't extend the economics arguments. In any case, Europe is part of the world, not the whole world. If you want to debate or talk about tech aspects of Surface, let's continue from that point.

As for Microsoft misjudging their timing with this release, I think you are totally wrong. Take a look at this: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57412457-94/global-sales-of-tablets-to-nearly-double-in-2012/

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "I won't extend the economics arguments. " }-

I don't blame you; you'll lose.

-{ Quote: "In any case, Europe is part of the world, not the whole world. " }-

ROTFLMAO ... you must be an American!

-{ Quote: "If you want to debate or talk about tech aspects of Surface, let's continue from that point." }-

I'm not really interested in tablet computers to be honest. I'm sure it's very clever & I would never say I wouldn't buy one, it's just unlikely.

-{ Quote: " As for Microsoft misjudging their timing with this release, I think you are totally wrong. Take a look at this: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57412457-94/global-sales-of-tablets-to-nearly-double-in-2012/" }-

I probably am totally wrong. I'm wrong about a lot of things. I'm not wrong about the recession in Europe though. After all, as you said, Europe is not the whole world. Only around 595 million people, I believe. ::)

[guest]

See that again:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union#Economic_growth

Your country (UK) is in red (still +0.8% in GPD, but that's somewhat classified as red lol), but Estonia and Lithuania for example showed +7.6% and +5.9%, respectively.

The biggest economies of that group (Germany's and France's) are in green as well: +3.0% and +1.8%, respectively.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "See that again:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union#Economic_growth

Your country (UK) is in red (still +0.8% in GPD, but that's somewhat classified as red lol), but Estonia and Lithuania for example showed +7.6% and +5.9%, respectively.

The biggest economies of that group (Germany's and France's) are in green as well: +3.0% and +1.8%, respectively." }-

I have family in France. Several family members have just been made redundant. One of those relatives was a highly educated software engineer.

Your Wackopedia figures are pointless. They, like you, don't live in the reality of the recent recession.

Like I said, some of my French relatives are probably wondering about being able to pay utility bills. Fancy tablet computers are the least thing on their minds, I should imagine.

I just don't think that Microsoft have judged or timed this release particularly well. Unless they plan on giving it away, of course.

[Dermot7]

Originally posted by Baserk:
-{ Quote: "A more precise price than Ultrabookish would be nice." }-
I don't think MS can put this very slick piece of kit into the retailers at a low enough price to ensure it gets a good 'lift-off'...it would have to be low (e.g. circa £300-350), but perhaps they'd be willing to take a big loss on it for a while?
And Daveski17 is definitely correct about the recession...it's dire, and no light at the end of the tunnel, in truth.
Why also the 3 month wait for the Pro version...doesn't make sense unless they're allowing for possibility of abandoning project if unsuccessful initially perhaps?

[tgell]

-{ Quote: "A more precise price than Ultrabookish would be nice. And another minor detail for a portable device; battery time.
It looks fair though, kudos for MS reg. design. But IE better work..:P" }-

Hey Baserk,
When you mentioned IE working, your were referring to this? I think Microsoft should have gotten their ducks in a row before the demo. I remember the infamous bluescreen with Gates.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTrWPqS4Kxk

[guest]

That freeze was planned intentionally to give the crowd a moment to lol. lmao

[tgell]

-{ Quote: "That freeze was planned intentionally to give the crowd a moment to lol. lmao" }-

Can you give me a link saying it was intentional? Everything I have seen on the web says it was unplanned.

[guest]

Besides, it's way better for the product to crash before it is launched and sold (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/7558319/Apple-iPad-launch-marred-by-technical-problems.html)...

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Your Wackopedia figures are pointless. They, like you, don't live in the reality of the recent recession." }-

The figures of GPD growth are stated in Wikipedia, but they aren't from Wikipedia. They are from the IMF.

The reality might be morphing, but still, 2008 to 2009 was probably worse.

Worldwide, the tablet sales have never been so good. It's the right time for this launch.

[guest]

How Microsoft kept Surface tablet a secret (http://www.techradar.com/news/mobile-computing/tablets/how-microsoft-kept-surface-tablet-a-secret-1086116)

Interesting read. ;D

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "The figures of GPD growth are stated in Wikipedia, but they aren't from Wikipedia. They are from the IMF." }-

Either way, GDP growth is irrelevant to the fact that there is a recession. It's like trying to claim that there is a tangible link between high inflation & high unemployment. There have been Pacific Rim economies in the recent past which have had massive inflation with little unemployment. Your argument just isn't cogent.

-{ Quote: "The reality might be morphing, but still, 2008 to 2009 was probably worse." }-

Morphing? ??? No, NOW is probably (definitely) worse. I honestly think that unless MS either take a loss on Surface (at least at an introductory price) or price it well under the iPad, it will fail.

-{ Quote: "Worldwide, the tablet sales have never been so good. It's the right time for this launch." }-

Compared to what? Are tablets outselling laptops yet? Europe is having a difficult time at the moment, regardless of Wiki's out of date 'statistics'. I really don't see most people who even still have jobs making something so new a priority buy. Someone earlier made the point that if Surface isn't successful it may even be discontinued at some point. How many people would risk several hundred quid on an untested product when they can buy an iPad?

There are a billion people on the Indian subcontinent, a huge majority don't even have electricity yet, let alone a preference for tablet computers that cost £700. What's the average daily wage in the Third World do you reckon? China may be a potential market.

I stand by what I have said. It's a bit of bad luck for MS that there is a worldwide recession now. Incidentally, even the US economy is hoping that Europe will be able to improve in the next few years as this will inevitably have a knock-on negative impact on American economics.

I understand why MS can't postpone the launch, obviously they have been planning this for a long time. I just don't think that they have got this right. I have a feeling Win 8 & Surface are going to be an expensive disaster for MS. I just hope that they haven't put all of their cyber eggs in one basket with this one.

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "
I understand why MS can't postpone the launch, obviously they have been planning this for a long time. I just don't think that they have got this right. I have a feeling Win 8 & Surface are going to be an expensive disaster for MS. I just hope that they haven't put all of their cyber eggs in one basket with this one." }-
MS does VERY well. They can afford to have Win 8 and Surface be a total disaster, and yet they will live on and prosper. I don't think they're worried...

[guest]

The [/URL]IMF regards periods when global growth is less than 3% to be global recessions. Global growth is projected to grow at 3.5 percent in 2012. So a recession isn't happening now, thanks mainly to the BRICS (Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa).

See: [url]http://www.conference-board.org/data/globaloutlook.cfm (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Monetary_Fund)

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "MS does VERY well. They can afford to have Win 8 and Surface be a total disaster, and yet they will live on and prosper. I don't think they're worried..." }-

I should imagine that they will survive, but this makes me wonder why they didn't invest their vast *spondoolie reserves in separate operating systems for tablets & desktops. A pure desktop Win 8 would have been a sure-fire winner I would have imagined, considering the success of Win 7.

*money

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "The IMF regards periods when global growth is less than 3% to be global recessions. Global growth is projected to grow at 3.5 percent in 2012. So a recession isn't happening now, thanks mainly to the BRICS (Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa)." }-

Thank god for that! And I thought it was just me (plus the half a billion people in Europe). ::)

Just keep repeating the mantra 'there is no recession' won't make it go away.

“I’ll pick you up in my car.”
“Oh, you have a car?”
“No. I used to have a car & a chauffeur, but
I couldn’t afford both, so I got rid of the car.”
“What good is a chauffeur without a car?”
“I need him to drive me to work.”
“How can he drive you to work without a car?”
“It’s-a okay. I don’t have a job.”

~ Chico & Groucho, Duck Soup

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "I should imagine that they will survive, but this makes me wonder why they didn't invest their vast *spondoolie reserves in separate operating systems for tablets & desktops. A pure desktop Win 8 would have been a sure-fire winner I would have imagined, considering the success of Win 7.

*money" }-
I wondered about that too. Separate systems for tablets and laptop/desktops sounds best to me too. I'm sure they have their reasons and ultimate plans. It will be really interesting to see how all this plays out in the next year or so...

[guest]

-{ Quote: "I should imagine that they will survive, but this makes me wonder why they didn't invest their vast *spondoolie reserves in separate operating systems for tablets & desktops. A pure desktop Win 8 would have been a sure-fire winner I would have imagined, considering the success of Win 7.

*money" }-

Because most consumers want a seamlessly experience. Besides, desktops and laptops will start to come out with touchscreens just like they come out with touchpad and keyboards - and for that extra input method, Metro is way better. You can always switch to the desktop mode, whenever you like, and while Start Menu functionality was natively replaced by the Start Screen, it can be restored with, for example, Start8 from Stardock which is freeware.

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "Besides, desktops and laptops will start to come out with touchscreens just like they come out with touchpad and keyboards -" }-
I certainly don't want a touchscreen on a desktop. And I don't really want one on a laptop either. I don't think most people want that.. It's only appropriate on a tablet....

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Just keep repeating the mantra 'there is no recession' won't make it go away." }-

A recession might be happening where you live, IDK. But you are extending that to the globe, which just isn't correct.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Because most consumers want a seamlessly experience. " }-

Do you honestly believe this marketing rhetoric? I may have whizzed myself a bit as I nearly just laughed myself unconscious. :wacko:

[guest]

-{ Quote: "I certainly don't want a touchscreen on a desktop. And I don't really want one on a laptop either. I don't think most people want that.. It's only appropriate on a tablet...." }-

Because you don't know the possible scenario usages doesn't mean they don't exist.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Do you honestly believe this marketing rhetoric? I may have whizzed myself a bit as I nearly just laughed myself unconscious. :wacko:" }-

I honestly believe it. I would hate to be restricted to a smartphone OS like iOS on my Surface. It would be a shame and an insult to its capabilities.

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "Because you don't know the possible scenario usages doesn't mean they don't exist." }-
What the heck does that mean?? I don't want a touchscreen desktop because I don't want to hold my arm up all day to use it. Same with a laptop more or less.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "What the heck does that mean?? I don't want a touchscreen desktop because I don't want to hold my arm up all day to use it. Same with a laptop more or less." }-

Honestly, you would hold your arm up all day only if you were mentally impaired. Keyboards, touchpads and mouses aren't going anywhere. Microsoft's mentality for touchscreen is that it is supposed to be an extra input method, not an exclusive input method. That's why Surface will come with those nice design decisions to make it actually more usable than any other tablet in the market.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "A recession might be happening where you live, IDK. But you are extending that to the globe, which just isn't correct." }-

It is correct that a downturn in purchasing in Europe's half a billion population will inevitably affect the global economy. Even so, the 'global economy' isn't exactly booming is it?

Take your example of Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa. I don't know about Brazil, but most of the population of India have never seen a mobile phone, let alone a tablet computer. Hundreds of millions live in terrible poverty. Russia has a lot of problems at the moment, huge unemployment is just one of them. As for South Africa; 25% of the population is unemployed & lives on less than one pound (Sterling) a day.

The global economy may not be in recession, but it isn't exactly booming either.

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "Honestly, you would hold your arm up all day only if you were mentally impaired. Keyboards, touchpads and mouses aren't going anywhere. Microsoft's mentality for touchscreen is that it is supposed to be an extra input method, not an exclusive input method. That's why Surface will come with those nice design decisions to make it actually more usable than any other tablet in the market." }-
That's fine if it's an extra and not exclusive input method... I'll accept that. Please let MS know it's ok then.. :)

[guest]

@daveski

Yes I agree. 3.5% global growth isn't recession but it's not a number to celebrate..

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "I honestly believe it. " }-

Don't buy any real estate on the moon. ;)

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "@daveski

Yes I agree. 3.5% global growth isn't recession but it's not a number to celebrate.." }-

And probably not the right time to launch a totally new untested product onto the market then ...

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Don't buy any real estate on the moon. ;)" }-

I would never buy something like Surface if it came with XP Tablet Edition or iOS. As I said, such Operating Systems for such hardware are insulting.

-{ Quote: "And probably not the right time to launch a totally new untested product onto the market then ..." }-
They don't need to take into account all those figures. Tablets are selling well, it's one of the few markets that are actually expanding sales in big numbers.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "They don't need to take into account all those figures. Tablets are selling well, it's one of the few markets that are actually expanding sales in big numbers." }-

How are tablet sales compared to laptop sales though? Honestly, to me anyway, a netbook costing less than half of the price of a tablet would be a much better buy. I don't blame MS for wanting to grab some of the tablet sales. I just think that Surface is going to have to be really special, or have some serious advantage over the ipad, to be as successful.

[Kerodo]

-{ Quote: "How are tablet sales compared to laptop sales though? Honestly, to me anyway, a netbook costing less than half of the price of a tablet would be a much better buy. I don't blame MS for wanting to grab some of the tablet sales. I just think that Surface is going to have to be really special, or have some serious advantage over the ipad, to be as successful." }-
Doesn't it have to compete with low cost Android tablets as well?

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "I'm sure they have their reasons and ultimate plans. " }-

My guess is that it is to make desktop users feel comfortable enough to purchase a Surface tablet through familiarity. Although I also think that this Win 8 hybrid may backfire by turning many off it as an OS.

-{ Quote: "It will be really interesting to see how all this plays out in the next year or so..." }-

Yes, it will. *searches for crystal ball*

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Doesn't it have to compete with low cost Android tablets as well?" }-

Oh yeah, I forgot the cheap Androids.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "How are tablet sales compared to laptop sales though?" }-
I don't know..

-{ Quote: "Honestly, to me anyway, a netbook costing less than half of the price of a tablet would be a much better buy. I don't blame MS for wanting to grab some of the tablet sales." }-
It's a matter of looking into the details of both products and comparing them for your personal usage scenarios. In my case, Surface would be more useful to all my personal usage scenarios than any netbook in the market . The only scenario I can't see me using Surface is hardcore gaming. For such usage scenario, nothing beats a desktop. Gaming laptops are interesting too, but the ones that actually work well are "rare" (difficult to find the models), big (they have to be big, after all - small screens for hardcore gaming are lame) and very expensive (see alienware's prices for examples, lol).

-{ Quote: "I just think that Surface is going to have to be really special, or have some serious advantage over the ipad, to be as successful." }-

Technically, it really is (see this (http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/Microsoft-Surface-vs-iPad-10-Reasons-to-Ditch-Apples-Tablet-556394/) and this (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/19/surface-ipad-tablet_n_1610331.html)). I don't know about prices, but if their word on "competitive" holds true...

[mirimir]

-{ Quote: "What the heck does that mean?? I don't want a touchscreen desktop because I don't want to hold my arm up all day to use it. Same with a laptop more or less." }-
The touchscreen will be the surface of your desk.

[NGRhodes]

Microsoft historically have been prepared to take a loss on hardware to gain market share and it seems to work for them long term.

[gerardwil]

What happened to the tablet pc introduced by Bill Gates 10 years ago?

[guest]

"Microsoft Tablet PC" wasn't made by Microsoft - they gave that name to any PC following certain specs. Back then, Microsoft was making only the OS - XP Tablet Edition.

Anyways, Surface is cool, that piece of ... isn't... IMO, of course.

[zapjb]

Rumored pricing of Surface.
ARM-based Windows RT variant reportedly aiming for $599
Intel-based Windows 8 Pro version would cost around $799

http://www.slashgear.com/microsoft-surface-reportedly-wifi-only-22235243/

With the new iPad $499-$829.
I predict if MS holds to these rumored prices the surface will be a big FAIL.


Oh yeah the Surface is supposed to be WiFi only.
There goes a couple million units MS could have sold with Cellular Contract subsidies.

[guest]

Neowin reports a different prediction: http://www.neowin.net/news/what-we-know-and-dont-know-about-microsofts-surface


Price: The ARM-based Surface will probably retail for around $500, while the Pro Surface for around $800-900I'll hope for the best. They need to be smart with this pricing.

-{ Quote: "Rumored pricing of Surface.
ARM-based Windows RT variant reportedly aiming for $599
Intel-based Windows 8 Pro version would cost around $799

http://www.slashgear.com/microsoft-surface-reportedly-wifi-only-22235243/

With the new iPad $499-$829.
I predict if MS holds to these rumored prices the surface will be a big FAIL.


Oh yeah the Surface is supposed to be WiFi only.
There goes a couple million units MS could have sold with Cellular Contract subsidies." }-

[guest]

And Surface comes with USB ports so you can plugin a mouse or a 3G/4G modem or USB extenders, for example.

[zapjb]

I still think the Surface has to be priced around 25-30% cheaper than the iPad. And be available from ATT or VZW at a sharp discount say 50-75% off with a 2yr contract. Without either of these conditions the Surface will not last more than 2 years on the market. Certainly the Surface will not reach a third of iPad sales. I say they'd be lucky to garner even 20% of iPad sales. Big FAIL MS.

[tgell]

I believe the main reason Microsoft did not provide separate OS's for the tablet and desktop was to force developers to provide apps for the MetroUI. Being that Microsoft has virtually no tablet market share, they need apps to be developed quickly to compete with Apple. If there was no Metro on the desktop OS, that would have taken forever. Maybe I am wrong but that is my take on it.

That aside, I agree that full size USB ports on the Surface is a big plus.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "I still think the Surface has to be priced around 25-30% cheaper than the iPad. And be available from ATT or VZW at a sharp discount say 50-75% off with a 2yr contract. Without either of these conditions the Surface will not last more than 2 years on the market. Certainly the Surface will not reach a third of iPad sales. I say they'd be lucky to garner even 20% of iPad sales. Big FAIL MS." }-

I hope they listen to your pricing suggestions somewhat ;D, but I don't believe it will be a fail if they don't.

[zapjb]

-{ Quote: "I hope they listen to your pricing suggestions somewhat ;D, but I don't believe it will be a fail if they don't." }-
Do you think the Surface will reach even 20% of iPad sales?

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Do you think the Surface will reach even 20% of iPad sales?" }-
This is impossible to even "estimate" at this time IMO. We need to wait and see official replies from Microsoft about Surface's pricing and international availability as well as know how they will market Surface going forward (the introduction was pretty good). Technically, Surface is a superior device, no doubt on that, and because of this it has the potential to supersede iPad's sales.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "I don't know.. " }-

Let's hope MS know. I'd wager laptops still sell more though.

-{ Quote: "It's a matter of looking into the details of both products and comparing them for your personal usage scenarios. In my case, Surface would be more useful to all my personal usage scenarios than any netbook in the market . The only scenario I can't see me using Surface is hardcore gaming. For such usage scenario, nothing beats a desktop. Gaming laptops are interesting too, but the ones that actually work well are "rare" (difficult to find the models), big (they have to be big, after all - small screens for hardcore gaming are lame) and very expensive (see alienware's prices for examples, lol)." }-

Personal usage scenarios? Erm ... I open my notebook. I switch it on. I check my email. I surf. I sometimes (rarely) watch a DVD. I occasionally watch some streamed TV (BBC iPlayer, some IBA). I sometimes listen to streamed radio (BBC 3/4). Can a tablet really improve my personal usage scenario that much? I'm only stating this as this is going to be asked by potential customers.


-{ Quote: "Technically, it really is (see this (http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/Microsoft-Surface-vs-iPad-10-Reasons-to-Ditch-Apples-Tablet-556394/) and this (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/19/surface-ipad-tablet_n_1610331.html)). I don't know about prices, but if their word on "competitive" holds true..." }-

I think the USB ports are a great advantage. That in itself could be very influential.

"Microsoft’s cover, meanwhile, includes screen protection, but doubles as a full, multi-touch keyboard, effectively turning the device into a notebook. That’s a really nice feature." ~ op cit

Yes, really nice. So why not just buy a conventional notebook for half the price then?

"Apple CEO Tim Cook said in April that 67 million iPads have sold since the device launched in early 2010" ~ op cit

I wonder how many conventional laptops/notebooks/netbooks have been sold since early 2010?

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Personal usage scenarios? Erm ... I open my notebook. I switch it on. I check my email. I surf. I sometimes (rarely) watch a DVD. I occasionally watch some streamed TV (BBC iPlayer, some IBA). I sometimes listen to streamed radio (BBC 3/4). Can a tablet really improve my personal usage scenario that much? I'm only stating this as this is going to be asked by potential customers." }-

Speaking about basic usage scenarios then, all known advantages of tablets apply to Surface - and none of the disadvantages apply (without this "major detail", I wouldn't want Surface too).

Talking only about the advantages of tablets, there are several articles on that. See these ones for some arguments:

- http://www.ehow.com/facts_4886016_what-advantages-tablet-pcs.html
- http://tabletbuyingguide.com/stepguide/tablet-vs-laptop.html

As the ehow's one isn't copyrighted, I will quote it here:

-{ Quote: "

Lighter Than Laptops

The extremely lightweight and handy characteristics of tablet PCs as compared to laptops are definitely the biggest advantage. Tablet PCs can be easily tucked under the arm and moved from place to place even by teenagers.

Personalization of Input

As tablet PCs are functional with the help of the special digital pen or stylus like gadget, the handwriting of a person becomes the input. This enables better personalization and value-addition to work-based input than possible with a touchpad or mouse.

Flat Working Surface

The form factor and convertible design characteristic of a tablet PC enables it to be laid flat on any working surface. This facilitates better presentations, personalized interactions with people or ability to showcase work to others in any work setting.

Electronic Input Leverage

In college or school classrooms, sales meetings, conferences, you can take down notes which are electronic inputs. These handwritten notes can be stored, accessed, reviewed, reorganized and synchronized with inputs in other formats to streamline work and create superior output or compelling presentations.

Other Advantages

Third-party software, applications and tools made specifically for tablet PCs, low-heat processor, longer battery life are some of the other advantages of tablet PCs." }-

[tgell]

The major disadvantage I see with tablets vs notebooks or desktops, especially desktops, is serviceability. I can tear down a desktop and replace individual components and desktop components can be had for pretty decent prices. Notebooks can be serviced but takes a little more to get at the components. To me, I wouldn't touch a tablet with a 10 foot pole when it came to repairing. I can imagine if something goes wrong with a tablet, you will be paying big bucks to get it serviced. That is why I tend to stay away from notebooks where possible and stick to desktops. Ease of service and cheap components makes the desktop my choice. Not to mention the ease of upgrading components.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "The major disadvantage I see with tablets vs notebooks or desktops, especially desktops, is serviceability. I can tear down a desktop and replace individual components and desktop components can be had for pretty decent prices. Notebooks can be serviced but takes a little more to get at the components. To me, I wouldn't touch a tablet with a 10 foot pole when it came to repairing. I can imagine if something goes wrong with a tablet, you will be paying big bucks to get it serviced. That is why I tend to stay away from notebooks where possible and stick to desktops. Ease of service and cheap components makes the desktop my choice. Not to mention the ease of upgrading components." }-

Yes, I agree totally. Which is when I buy another notebook/netbook, although I will always keep a desktop PC, it will be relatively cheap & functional. I think that you have a very good point with any tablet repair as well.

[guest]

Some functionality you get from a tablet, you can't get from other devices. Full desktop or gaming laptop + Surface is the best way to go for my usage scenarios relevant to what we are discussing here.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Lighter Than Laptops

The extremely lightweight and handy characteristics of tablet PCs as compared to laptops are definitely the biggest advantage. Tablet PCs can be easily tucked under the arm and moved from place to place even by teenagers." }-

In my experience, even teenagers seem to be able to carry laptops (tucked under the arm or otherwise) as well. My notebook is pretty light. I don't need to weight-train regularly to pick it up or tuck it anywhere. Just how much of an advantage is this weight difference?

-{ Quote: "Personalization of Input

As tablet PCs are functional with the help of the special digital pen or stylus like gadget, the handwriting of a person becomes the input. This enables better personalization and value-addition to work-based input than possible with a touchpad or mouse." }-

I don't know about you, but I type much faster than I can write & my handwriting is barely legible as it is. This kind of reminds me of the voice activation technology on a phone I once owned. If I shouted at it in a crowded pub, with a lot of ambient background noise, it usually wouldn't phone the person who's name I was shouting at it (plus people would look at me as if I was bonkers). Even in a totally quiet environment it took some convincing. On the other hand, I could just press speed dial.

-{ Quote: "Flat Working Surface

The form factor and convertible design characteristic of a tablet PC enables it to be laid flat on any working surface. This facilitates better presentations, personalized interactions with people or ability to showcase work to others in any work setting." }-

Again, I can't speak for everyone, but virtually all of my presentations (often OpenOffice Impress) are presented on an interactive board. I thought that was the whole point of presenting; i.e. you are presenting to an audience (of sorts). I also don't see how (or lying) on a flat surface necessarily facilitates better presentations. I still really don't see the advantage of a tablet over a laptop in the workplace. I'm pretty sure most of my students would quickly steal lose any 'snap-on' accessories (stands, external keyboards etc) that 'accessorised' any portable device.

-{ Quote: "Electronic Input Leverage

In college or school classrooms, sales meetings, conferences, you can take down notes which are electronic inputs. These handwritten notes can be stored, accessed, reviewed, reorganized and synchronized with inputs in other formats to streamline work and create superior output or compelling presentations." }-

Well, I have already elucidated my thoughts on tablet computers in an educational scenario.

-{ Quote: "Other Advantages

Third-party software, applications and tools made specifically for tablet PCs, " }-

Marketing hype & 'lock-in'? More stuff for gullible customers to spend their dosh on? ROTFL

-{ Quote: "low-heat processor, longer battery life are some of the other advantages of tablet PCs." }-

So, do all tablets have lower heat processors & longer battery life than all laptops, notebooks, netbooks etc?

That could actually be some advantage. But surely, a lot of that has to do with the OS anyway, doesn't it?

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Some functionality you get from a tablet, you can't get from other devices. " }-

Apparently tablets can't stand upright without a 'stand'. My notebook has the functionality of the screen being able to stand upright merely by being opened.
I find that very useful & functional. It doesn't actually need a stand. That's ergonomic if you ask me. ;)

[tgell]

-{ Quote: "Some functionality you get from a tablet, you can't get from other devices. Full desktop or gaming laptop + Surface is the best way to go for my usage scenarios relevant to what we are discussing here." }-

Well, the economy in the U.S. isn't so hot. Is a family that is having a tough time getting buy going to buy their child a tablet with a tiny screen for school or going with the more practical "homework" notebook with a 15 or 17 inch screen? I wager they go with a notebook. I doubt they would have a budget for a $500 or $800 tablet. Good notebooks around here can be had for $350 to $400.

It is going to interesting to see how "ordinary" people are going to view this "Hybrid" tablet with a keyboard.

Edit: I am not that familiar with the Ipad, but isn't it used mostly for pulling entertainment off the web?

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Apparently tablets can't stand upright without a 'stand'. My notebook has the functionality of the screen being able to stand upright merely by being opened.
I find that very useful & functional. It doesn't actually need a stand. That's ergonomic if you ask me. ;)" }-

True. That's one of the reasons why I like Surface so much: it comes with a native, nicely integrated kickstand! :thumb:

-{ Quote: "Well, the economy in the U.S. isn't so hot. Is a family that is having a tough time getting buy going to buy their child a tablet with a tiny screen for school or going with the more practical "homework" notebook with a 15 or 17 inch screen? I wager they go with a notebook. I doubt they would have a budget for a $500 or $800 tablet. Good notebooks around here can be had for $350 to $400.

It is going to interesting to see how "ordinary" people are going to view this "Hybrid" tablet with a keyboard.

Edit: I am not that familiar with the Ipad, but isn't it used mostly for pulling entertainment off the web?" }-

I would prefer Surface for such tasks. I can think about a lot of possibilities where it is more useful.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "In my experience, even teenagers seem to be able to carry laptops (tucked under the arm or otherwise) as well. My notebook is pretty light. I don't need to weight-train regularly to pick it up or tuck it anywhere. Just how much of an advantage is this weight difference?" }-

I think it's very relevant. I don't want to go to school with a big gaming laptop, for example. It just doesn't make sense. A netbook or a smaller notebook would be a waste of money when Surface can add just the same features + specific tablet features.

Let's also not forget about resistance: Surface has a magnesium case which was shown to be very resistant. In front of reporters, "Microsoft dropped a little bit of water on to the tablet and the water balled up and rolled right off. Microsoft said that it will handle grubby fingers with ease and apparently even tested it with ketchup and mustard." (http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt)

Surface also has a new and improved version of the Gorilla Glass, a series of aluminosilicate sheet glass engineered specifically to be thin, light and and most important IMO: damage-resistant too.

-{ Quote: "I don't know about you, but I type much faster than I can write & my handwriting is barely legible as it is. This kind of reminds me of the voice activation technology on a phone I once owned. If I shouted at it in a crowded pub, with a lot of ambient background noise, it usually wouldn't phone the person who's name I was shouting at it (plus people would look at me as if I was bonkers). Even in a totally quiet environment it took some convincing. On the other hand, I could just press speed dial." }-

You would appreciate Surface's cover then, as the the cover comes with an accelerometer, so it can measure the force of each finger and the keyboard samples 10x faster than any actual keyboard. (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/)

-{ Quote: "Again, I can't speak for everyone, but virtually all of my presentations (often OpenOffice Impress) are presented on an interactive board. I thought that was the whole point of presenting; i.e. you are presenting to an audience (of sorts). I also don't see how (or lying) on a flat surface necessarily facilitates better presentations. I still really don't see the advantage of a tablet over a laptop in the workplace. I'm pretty sure most of my students would quickly steal lose any 'snap-on' accessories (stands, external keyboards etc) that 'accessorised' any portable device." }-

This is related to beauty. If you were going to show something in the screen to a friend standing near you, what device would give a better impression? A tablet such as Surface or iPad with those astonishing Clear Type Full HD or Retina Display touchscreens, respectively, or a relatively cheap notebook/netbook? You may have very bad tastes if you say that notebooks/netbooks look better, lol.

-{ Quote: "Well, I have already elucidated my thoughts on tablet computers in an educational scenario." }-

I would prefer to go to the college with Surface any time. Big laptops just don't fit in better.

-{ Quote: "Marketing hype & 'lock-in'? More stuff for gullible customers to spend their dosh on? ROTFL" }-

Yeah. You replied to something that will be a moot point when Windows 8 becomes broadly available (at least for the Microsoft "ecosystem", of course).

-{ Quote: "So, do all tablets have lower heat processors & longer battery life than all laptops, notebooks, netbooks etc? " }-

Probably. Surface surely has.

-{ Quote: "That could actually be some advantage. But surely, a lot of that has to do with the OS anyway, doesn't it?" }-

True. Windows 8/RT is probably better suited to achieve this than its competitors - and Surface comes with it.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "True. That's one of the reasons why I like Surface so much: it comes with a native, nicely integrated kickstand! :thumb:" }-

Yeah ... sounds really physically stable. :thumbd:

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "I think it's very relevant. I don't want to go to school with a big gaming laptop, for example. It just doesn't make sense. A netbook or a smaller notebook would be a waste of money when Surface can add just the same features + specific tablet features. " }-

I wasn't making myself clear, sorry, I was thinking particularly of machines owned by an institution & used by students (& staff). Our Lenovo ThinkPads would be hard to beat for sheer durability IMO. ThinkPads have survived outer space (have been used on the ISS). So they have relatively easily survived problem teens & special needs students. Those Lenovo's are as indestructible as most laptops get. Unless you spend a lot of money on specialist scientific laptops for use in the field. I just don't see Surface (with its detachable bits) being as durable.

-{ Quote: "Let's also not forget about resistance: Surface has a magnesium case which was shown to be very resistant. In front of reporters, "Microsoft dropped a little bit of water on to the tablet and the water balled up and rolled right off. Microsoft said that it will handle grubby fingers with ease and apparently even tested it with ketchup and mustard." (http://www.neowin.net/news/hands-on-windows-surface-rt) " }-

Was that Coleman's English Mustard? Because that stuff can melt your face. How about testing it with grubby fingered problem teenagers who may try & use it as a cricket bat?

-{ Quote: "Surface also has a new and improved version of the Gorilla Glass, a series of aluminosilicate sheet glass engineered specifically to be thin, light and and most important IMO: damage-resistant too." }-

That's good to know.

-{ Quote: "You would appreciate Surface's cover then, as the the cover comes with an accelerometer, so it can measure the force of each finger and the keyboard samples 10x faster than any actual keyboard. (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/)" }-

I'll bet good money I would prefer a standard keyboard actually connected to a machine. Having said that, it would be easier to replace a Surface's keyboard I suppose. I know what would happen to detachable things in an educational environment. Probably the same thing that happens to traffic cones ...

-{ Quote: "This is related to beauty. If you were going to show something in the screen to a friend standing near you, what device would give a better impression? A tablet such as Surface or iPad with those astonishing Clear Type Full HD or Retina Display touchscreens, respectively, or a relatively cheap notebook/netbook? You may have very bad tastes if you say that notebooks/netbooks look better, lol." }-

Aesthetics are subjective. My relatively inexpensive notebook has a pretty good screen. How much better can it be? Marketing however isn't subjective, it is primarily used to convince people that they really need to buy something new. This is how they make money. This now brings me back to my original argument. In a poor global economy, with half a billion people in Europe facing the worst recession in living memory, with even supposedly prospering economies (BRICS?) having internal problems, unemployment, slow growth, endemic poverty & the like, what are most people going to buy? My guess is something that performs relatively well, is reliable proven technology, & affordable. From what I can see, Surface is neither proven or particularly affordable.



-{ Quote: "I would prefer to go to the college with Surface any time. Big laptops just don't fit in better." }-

But laptops don't need to be big to be viable.



-{ Quote: "Yeah. You replied to something that will be a moot point when Windows 8 becomes broadly available (at least for the Microsoft "ecosystem", of course)." }-

Microsoft ecosystems or no, lock-in & marketing are merely ways to separate people from their money.


-{ Quote: "Probably. Surface surely has." }-

A small advantage for a large unit price?

-{ Quote: "True. Windows 8/RT is probably better suited to achieve this than its competitors - and Surface comes with it." }-

I'm not disagreeing that Win 8 has a lot of improvements over Win 7, I should imagine there are many. Unfortunately, the hybridised tablet/desktop combination is not to the taste of a significant number of people.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "I wasn't making myself clear, sorry, I was thinking particularly of machines owned by an institution & used by students (& staff). Our Lenovo ThinkPads would be hard to beat for sheer durability IMO. ThinkPads have survived outer space (have been used on the ISS). So they have relatively easily survived problem teens & special needs students. Those Lenovo's are as indestructible as most laptops get. Unless you spend a lot of money on specialist scientific laptops for use in the field. I just don't see Surface (with its detachable bits) being as durable." }-
Still, Surface's touchscreen features two digitizers instead of a single one like most tablets. At the event live they said it best by stating, “This surface has two digitizers. One for touch, one for digital ink.” All stylus or pen input is converted into digital ink and the new Surface tablet is extremely responsive and accurate. The distance between the screen (digitizer) and the stylus is only .7mm thick, and allows for it to be highly accurate, making you feel like the ballpoint of a pen is actually writing on the “surface”. Surface will see the proximity of a stylus and stop recognizing hand inputs. (http://www.slashgear.com/microsoft-surface-to-feature-digital-ink-stylus-support-18234493/)

Students may really appreciate such features that aren't usually available in notebooks/netbooks..

-{ Quote: "Was that Coleman's English Mustard? Because that stuff can melt your face. How about testing it with grubby fingered problem teenagers who may try & use it as a cricket bat?" }-
lmao, that's very extreme. Teenager using it as a cricket bat = teenager wanting to intentionally break it. You can't stop that without some control on the behavior of the teenager, lol.

-{ Quote: "I'll bet good money I would prefer a standard keyboard actually connected to a machine. Having said that, it would be easier to replace a Surface's keyboard I suppose. I know what would happen to detachable things in an educational environment. Probably the same thing that happens to traffic cones ..." }-
But if you really prefer a "standard keyboard" despite its shortcomings, Surface can help you with the Type Cover. It connects to the Surface in the same way, but provides a tactile keyboard with touchpad. (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/) The Type Cover is 5 millimetres. And for the style-sensitive among us, they'll come in a variety of colours, including black, pink, red and blue. (http://www.neowin.net/news/five-unique-features-which-may-lead-to-surfaces-success)

-{ Quote: "Aesthetics are subjective. My relatively inexpensive notebook has a pretty good screen. How much better can it be?" }-
I would have to know the exact model to describe how much better it can be. :D

-{ Quote: "Marketing however isn't subjective, it is primarily used to convince people that they really need to buy something new. This is how they make money. This now brings me back to my original argument. In a poor global economy, with half a billion people in Europe facing the worst recession in living memory, with even supposedly prospering economies (BRICS?) having internal problems, unemployment, slow growth, endemic poverty & the like, what are most people going to buy? My guess is something that performs relatively well, is reliable proven technology, & affordable. From what I can see, Surface is neither proven or particularly affordable." }-
People is having generally good experiences with tablets that make them desirable devices. If not, sales of these devices wouldn't being experimenting such massive boosts every year. About "affordable", you are just as in the dark as me - we don't know details about the planned pricing of Surface.

-{ Quote: "A small advantage for a large unit price?" }-
They still didn't disclose the pricing details of Surface.

-{ Quote: "Microsoft ecosystems or no, lock-in & marketing are merely ways to separate people from their money." }-

They are tying to integrate the offers as much as possible.

-{ Quote: "I'm not disagreeing that Win 8 has a lot of improvements over Win 7, I should imagine there are many. Unfortunately, the hybridised tablet/desktop combination is not to the taste of a significant number of people." }-

The desktop mode and Start8 are available for those who don't like the improved interface that makes the touchscreen input method a real possibility.

[Daveski17]

-{ Quote: "Students may really appreciate such features that aren't usually available in notebooks/netbooks.." }-

Especially if those features are detachable. Because things like styluses can then be rammed into places or sold to people outside of the college perhaps.

-{ Quote: "lmao, that's very extreme. Teenager using it as a cricket bat = teenager wanting to intentionally break it. You can't stop that without some control on the behavior of the teenager, lol." }-

Well, I may have been exaggerating a bit. Either way, teaching students with special needs & behavioural problems in a deprived inner city area has convinced me to believe anything can happen.

-{ Quote: "But if you really prefer a "standard keyboard" despite its shortcomings, Surface can help you with the Type Cover. It connects to the Surface in the same way, but provides a tactile keyboard with touchpad. (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/) The Type Cover is 5 millimetres. And for the style-sensitive among us, they'll come in a variety of colours, including black, pink, red and blue. (http://www.neowin.net/news/five-unique-features-which-may-lead-to-surfaces-success)" }-

It sounds good in theory & marketing spiel, but so does everything. I'm a tad cynical when people try to sell me stuff I don't really need.

-{ Quote: "I would have to know the exact model to describe how much better it can be. :D" }-

You're not getting this. Most people are content with a decent picture/display on their screen. Only die-hards will spend a lot of extra dosh on an expensive screen. A car will get you from point 'a' to point 'b', be it a Bentley or a Skoda.

-{ Quote: "People is having generally good experiences with tablets that make them desirable devices. If not, sales of these devices wouldn't being experimenting such massive boosts every year. About "affordable", you are just as in the dark as me - we don't know details about the planned pricing of Surface." }-

There was an increase in European sales of Bugatti cars recently. It's not a very good indicator of what most people are buying automobile-wise though is it?

-{ Quote: "They still didn't disclose the pricing details of Surface." }-

I wonder why?

[moontan]

i just don't get these tablets thing at all.
you can get a decent laptop for cheaper than a tablet.

the tablet has touch screen, but beside that?

[Kerodo]

The nice thing about a tablet is it's size and light weight etc. But when you start adding a kick stand and keyboard, then it just becomes a cheap imitation of a laptop and defeats the whole purpose of being a tablet IMO.

I like tablets though. If I could get one that allowed me to put my files on it (usb port) and did everything I needed, then I'd be all over it. I think that'll probably happen soon..

[Baserk]

-{ Quote: "...The biggest economies of that group (Germany's and France's) are in green as well: +3.0% and +1.8%, respectively." }-
Please stop it. Greece implodes atm, the >trillion euro spent sofar hasn avoided a EU collapse sofar. Spain and Italy can still drag down the continent. Those Wiki percentages aren't arguments to claim any different. But let's argue Surface.
-{ Quote: "I don't think MS can put this very slick piece of kit into the retailers at a low enough price to ensure it gets a good 'lift-off'...it would have to be low (e.g. circa £300-350)..." }-
With a price range of $600 to $1,500 (Ultrabookish) it seems likely, the Pro will cost much more. Then again, MS is aiming for a completely new tablet user. who likes a quadcore CPU to perform traditional 'heavy duty' tasks on a tablet with a sleeve-keyboard.
A different market share (if not new) then that of leisure tablet consumers.
-{ Quote: "Hey Baserk,
When you mentioned IE working, your were referring to this?" }-Yep.
-{ Quote: "That freeze was planned intentionally to give the crowd a moment to lol. lmao" }-
Huh? Sinofsky has been studying 'Method Acting'? The sighs, raised eyebrows, the voice breaking.
Intentional, my backside.

[guest]

-{ Quote: "The nice thing about a tablet is it's size and light weight etc. But when you start adding a kick stand and keyboard, then it just becomes a cheap imitation of a laptop and defeats the whole purpose of being a tablet IMO. " }-

These things make Surface actually much more usable. The kickstand doesn't add anything to the size and is invisible when you're not using it. The keyboards are pretty advanced covers that are attached via magnetic connection whenever you want. Surface's design is definitely not a cheap imitation of anything, but a great improvement, a step in the right direction toward greater usability. I recommend you to watch the videos demonstrating how it can be actually used. If you are genuinely interested in tech, you'll surely be impressed.

[aigle]

Seems a useless discussion, sorry to say. Will it be successful or not, time still tell you soon.
If you like it, it's ok, if you don't like it, still it's ok I think.
Let's wait and see.

[Noob]

I'm not bashing the Surface but i just think it won't be a huge success. ;D ::)

[zapjb]

I'm not bashing it either. It's just MS rumored pricing & WiFi only makes me think they're nuts. But maybe it's just a proof of concept project. And not meant to be profitable or longterm. MS might be saying to their hardware partners this is what we can do. So you better make you tablets better than the Surface. Or else we'll go into mass production, lower the price dramatically & partner up with Cellphone Carriers.

[guest]

About pricing let's wait for Microsoft's official word.

And don't forget that Surface has USB ports. It could be sold by Cellphone Carriers with a 3g/4g modem included in the package, for example.

[funkydude]

-{ Quote: "And don't forget that Surface has USB ports. It could be sold by Cellphone Carriers with a 3g/4g modem included in the package, for example." }-

Or you could simply use your current sim card in your current smartphone by turning on the WiFi hotspot feature.

[AlexC]

Demonstration:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSaXj1vIGxo

[guest]

-{ Quote: "Demonstration:
-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSaXj1vIGxo-" }-

Let me guess, that link about the "fail" being posted again. I don't even need to open it to know, coming from you.

[AlexC]

No hate here, i´ve just found it very funny ;D

[Cudni]

https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showpost.php?p=2075152&postcount=100

[guest]

Editorial: Did Microsoft solve its perception issue this week? (http://www.neowin.net/news/did-microsoft-solve-its-perception-issue-this-week)

-{ Quote: "...There's been an ongoing debate (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-03-08/can-kinect-make-windows-cool-again) on what will truly make Microsoft "cool again." While Apple's largely dominated the portable music player, smartphone and tablet industries, Microsoft has continued to focus on the decidedly unsexy areas of software and services in recent years, save Microsoft's wildly successful Xbox gaming console. As the company's proven this week, however, it appears Microsoft's willing to go the extra mile to appease consumers and change perception. As Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer wrote in an internal memo earlier this week, the company is attempting to redefine itself through innovation. "I love that we aren’t afraid to make big bold bets," Ballmer wrote, clearly referring – at least in part – to the overhaul of the traditional Windows design in Windows 8 and Windows RT. But it hasn't merely been the events from this week that may change perception of Microsoft; the company has slowly changed itself from a software-driven company to a company that can succeed on multiple fronts...

Read more: http://www.neowin.net/news/did-microsoft-solve-its-perception-issue-this-week" }-

[aigle]

I think Asus will be in a good competition with MS Slate.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/06/04/asus-tablet-600/#continued

[guest]

Article from 4th June (I already posted about it in another thread (http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=325560)). Besides, it's not even close to Surface's tech.

[Tsast42]

In its favour it isn't really a tablet as it isn't a computer without any of the useful bits. At the other end the construction of the fully assembled device brings to mind a laptop with broken hinges. Moving the machine about - the whole point of a mobile computer - with that floppy joint and its little stand to prop the screen up will become a neverending horror.

The relative functionality of such confabulations isn't what makes them sell anyway. It takes a long time for improved utility to translate into sales; typewriters retained their popularity long after the desktop computer offered a quicker way to mass produce documents and by similar note as someone mentioned the great commercial success of the Xbox I thought I'd point out that they were subsiding its losses for years. As with the iToys what determines the immediate profitability of such gadgets is the "Ooh look, Shiny" effect. Does the Surface have it? I guess we'll find out, but I'm guessing that Microsoft are in any case more interested in the wider impact with this release.

[aigle]

-{ Quote: "Article from 4th June (I already posted about it in another thread (http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=325560)). Besides, it's not even close to Surface's tech." }-
I know it,s old and may not be close to Surface but it,s highly valid here as:

- Asus might price ii well below the Surface so people can afford it easily.
- Using Intel,s medfield processor, x86 version of Win 8 tablet from Asus might be just as thin and light as ARM version.
- The specifications of these may be well below that of Surface but these might suffice many of ordinary users.

[Gullible Jones]

I think the Surface "tablet" and Windows 8 may actually be a major improvement on the current state of affairs in mobile computing. Windows 8, whatever you can say about its interface, is a Real Operating System. You can write documents on it, even compile stuff. Also, the Surface has a built in keyboard, which should be enormously better than the on-screen bogo-keyboards of the iPad and other tablets.

Tablets are... tablets. The Surface, by its appearance, is a colorful netbook with a touch screen. The Pro version is even x86, with a CPU faster than the one in my Dell Precision workstation. This thing is not a toy, it is a real computer.

I still can't say I'm impressed with the idea of a Windows App Store or whatever, but this all looks like a vast improvement on shiny tablets with no keyboards and toy OSes. Maybe if it catches on, other vendors will start to get the message.

[guest]

Microsoft Surface: a gentle kick in the teeth of the OEMs (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/microsoft-surface-a-gentle-kick-in-the-teeth-of-the-oems/)

-{ Quote: "If you want something done properly, as the old adage goes, you have to do it yourself. For the longest time, the failure to produce a good, usable Windows tablet was twofold. Microsoft lacked an operating system usable with finger input, and the PC OEMs failed to produce devices that were thin enough and light enough to be comfortable when handheld. The first problem is, to a greater or lesser extent, addressed by Windows 8 and its ARM counterpart, Windows RT. But the software is nothing without the hardware to run it on.

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/microsoft-surface-a-gentle-kick-in-the-teeth-of-the-oems/" }-

[guest]

How Microsoft's tablet Touch Cover could change game controls (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/06/how-microsofts-tablet-touch-cover-could-change-game-controls/)

-{ Quote: "When Microsoft first unveiled a pair of smartcovers with integrated keyboards (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/) as a key part of its Windows 8 tablet strategy (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/06/wait-theres-a-tablet-too-microsoft-announces-type-and-touch-covers/) last week, most commentators saw the move as an attempt to position the tablet computers more directly against standard laptops. But for gamers, the Touch Cover in particular could open up some interesting new control options for PC games, if Microsoft and developers are savvy enough to capitalize on its potential. The key to the Touch Cover's hidden potential as a new form of game control comes in its keyboard's little-noticed ability to differentiate between various levels of pressure being placed on each key. Microsoft's Panos Patay points out this feature about 41 minutes into the video of the tablet announcement (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeWQnC9ahVo), highlighting how the Touch Cover is "actually measuring every gram of force coming off my fingertips."

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/06/how-microsofts-tablet-touch-cover-could-change-game-controls/" }-

[guest]

Microsoft Surface: Game developers' reactions (http://www.neogamr.net/news/microsoft-surface-game-developers-reactions)

-{ Quote: "Last week, Microsoft announced it was getting into the PC hardware business with the reveal of the Microsoft Surface tablet (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-22-what-video-game-developers-think-of-surface). The 10.6 inch touch screen device, with versions for both Windows 8 and Windows RT, should begin shipping with the Windows RT product later this year. It's a bold move from Microsoft and it could affect how PC game-based developer create and release new titles.

Epic Games' VP Mark Rein quickly posted up his thoughts on Surface. He posted up word on his Twitter page this week (https://twitter.com/MarkRein/status/214903374070562818), "Microsoft NAILS IT! Way to go Microsoft! Surface looks AWESOME! Can't wait to get some Unreal Engine games on those babies!."

Read more: http://www.neogamr.net/news/microsoft-surface-game-developers-reactions" }-

[guest]

Bring on the Pablet: Why I am bullish about Microsoft's Surface (http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/bring-on-the-pablet-why-i-am-bullish-about-microsofts-surface/13071)

-{ Quote: "Summary: Call it a tablet, a PC, a Pablet or a TC: All I can say is so far, the Microsoft Surface is my best hope for something that may make Windows 8 more palatable.

Read more: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/bring-on-the-pablet-why-i-am-bullish-about-microsofts-surface/13071" }-

[mirimir]

Windows 8 reminds me of WOW ( -http://www.mywowcomputer.com ) ;) Maybe that's the market.

[guest]

Microsoft and OEMs: New game, new rules (http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/microsoft-and-oems-new-game-new-rules/5180)

-{ Quote: "Summary: PC makers and Microsoft have enjoyed a mostly stable relationship that has lasted for some three decades. But times, and competition, have changed. Microsoft’s latest moves are a sane reaction to partners that have drifted away.

Read more: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/microsoft-and-oems-new-game-new-rules/5180" }-

[Pinga]

That's quite enough Microsoft propaganda, thanks.

[guest]

Sherlund: Microsoft's Surface will be licensing Windows same as other OEMs (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/microsoftpri0/2018563387_sherlund_microsofts_surface_will_be_licensing_wind.html)

-{ Quote: "There are lots of interesting tidbits from a note to investors (http://www.nomuranow.com/research/globalresearchportal/getpub.aspx?pid=530329&cid=WWhkcnVZZXNyUzg90) that Nomura analyst Rick Sherlund just sent out, following his meeting this morning with Microsoft Corporate Vice President Mike Angiulo and Windows division Chief Financial Office Tami Reller. Among the highlights...

Read more: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/microsoftpri0/2018563387_sherlund_microsofts_surface_will_be_licensing_wind.html" }-

[Baserk]

-{ Quote: "That's quite enough Microsoft propaganda, thanks." }-
Don't get your hopes up. Seems like a neverending blue bold wave...

[guest]

-{ Quote: "That's quite enough Microsoft propaganda, thanks." }-

"Please don't act desperate, even if you are." ::)

[BlueZannetti]

To all....

Just a personal perspective here - simply because you can post oodles of links from the vast expanse of the Internet, doesn't mean you should feel compelled to do so. The simple fact of the matter is that much of what passes for technical analyses these days is repackaged marketing drivel. This is not unique to tech news, it seems to be impacting virtually all information sources and all topically focused camps are guilty in this situation.

Let's try for some level of curation which elevates the level of discourse.

Finally..., let's keep the discussion focused on the topic rather than turning towards the posters.

Thanks in advance.

Blue

[guest]

Kay, I'll try to be even more selective (but if you review the links I posted, they all come from reputable sources and contain relevant info - but some will always see marketing in everything).

[Pinga]

-{ Quote: "Microsoft has a corporate history of disinformation going back to its very inception." }-
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Microsoft

[Pinga]

-{ Quote: "if you review the links I posted, they all come from reputable sources and contain relevant info - but some will always see marketing in everything" }-
Astroturfing, actually:
-{ Quote: "Astroturfing is a form of propaganda whose techniques usually consist of a few people attempting to give the impression that mass numbers of enthusiasts advocate some specific cause. " }-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing

[NGRhodes]

guest,

IMHO the problem is your copy and pasting a lot of news and information that many of the tech savvy on here read anyhow (and a reason I skim past a lot of your posts as I get most of what you post in my feed reader), what would be useful is if add your own commentary, opinion, points, as this not a news site, but a discussion forum and I know you are capable of intelligent conversion and debate :)

Cheers, Nick.

[Noob]

-{ Quote: "Astroturfing, actually:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing" }-
Woah excellent post, at least for me. Now i know a new word. ;D

-{ Quote: "http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Microsoft" }-
Interesting article.
I knew MS-DOS was not created by MS itself in it's beginnings . . . But i never knew there were so many products of MS that were actually purchased.

~ Removed Comments ~

[Dermot7]

-{ Quote: "In a filing with the US Security and Exchange Commission (SEC), Microsoft admitted something it has been silent about with the public: Yes, the first Surface tablets will ship to customers on October 26, the same day that Windows 8 arrives." }-
http://www.winsupersite.com/article/paul-thurrotts-wininfo/microsoft-surface-tablet-ship-october-26-windows-8-143873

[Triple Helix]

-{ Quote: "http://www.winsupersite.com/article/paul-thurrotts-wininfo/microsoft-surface-tablet-ship-october-26-windows-8-143873" }-

Thanks Dermot!

TH