Dual-boot / OSS with XP and Vista

[Doctor Jellybean]

I had 2 installations of XP, and had no problems with OSS. The one XP installation has now been replaced with Vista 64, and OSS found it without a problem.

However, if I select Vista, OSS disappears and the Vista boot menu appears. How can I bypass the Vista boot menu after using OSS?

Thanks.

[MudCrab]

Is the Vista boot menu showing options to boot Vista or XP?

Does XP still boot correctly from OSS? If so, it may be easier to just set Vista as the default in Vista's boot manager and set the timeout value very low.

[Doctor Jellybean]

Vista boot menu shows options for both XP and Vista. XP does boot correctly from Vista boot menu, as well as from OSS.

I would prefer to get rid of Vista boot menu altogether, all that unelegant text scrolling on the screen.

[MudCrab]

If you remove the XP boot entry from the BCD file, I think Vista should boot automatically without displaying the menu.

You can see the bcdedit command needed in Part 5, Figure 5.6 of the Separation Guide (http://www.themudcrab.com/separatevistaxp.php). This is assuming that {ntldr} has been assigned for your XP installation (the default). You should be able to run the command while booted into Vista (just make sure to run the Command Prompt in Administrator Mode (http://www.themudcrab.com/vistaadmincp.php)).

Your only other option may be to actually separate XP and Vista as detailed in the guide.

[Doctor Jellybean]

Would I be able to do the same with OSS if I do the following:

1) Format the Vista partition
2) Hide the XP partition
3) Install Vista

Then use OSS to update the bootwiz file.

[MudCrab]

That should work. However, note that the Vista installation will still show the XP partition even though it's hidden so make sure to select the correct one as the Vista installation destination partition. Also, make sure the Vista partition is set Active before you install. I also recommend you let Vista reformat the destination partition as part of the installation procedure (especially if you've used DD to format it).

[Doctor Jellybean]

Nope, that didn't work.

I started DD, hidden the XP partition, set Vista partition active and did a fresh, formatted install of Vista. Upon rebooting the Vista boot manager appears, displaying both Vista and XP as options.

Maybe I need to install Vista first, then XP? Or, one day when I'm happy enough with Vista, ditch XP alltogether.

[Doctor Jellybean]

I did a google for something else, and found this: EasyBCD

http://neosmart.net/dl.php?id=1

I might just give that a try.

[K0LO]

As long as you can set the XP partition active and have the PC boot directly into XP (or have the boot process controlled by OS Selector) then the advice given in MudCrab's post #4 should work. Just remove the XP entry from the Vista BCD and you won't see the Vista boot menu any more.

[Doctor Jellybean]

-{ Quote: "As long as you can set the XP partition active and have the PC boot directly into XP (or have the boot process controlled by OS Selector) then the advice given in MudCrab's post #4 should work. Just remove the XP entry from the Vista BCD and you won't see the Vista boot menu any more." }-

Think I'll have to do that. Looks complicated tho', but will have that page open on laptop to guide me through the process.

Thanks!

[Doctor Jellybean]

Is it possible to rename any of these folders

http://www.themudcrab.com/images/vxp-split/vistaxpsplit11.jpg

before starting this process? That way I'll know for sure which is which.

[MudCrab]

I would not recommend renaming either of the Windows folders. An easier solution would be to just put a text file in the root of each Windows partition. For example, you could put a file named MyXP.txt in the C:\ of the XP partition and MyVista.txt in the C:\ of the Vista partition. You can then do a DIR on the root folder, see the file and know which partition it is.

Also, if you have your partitions labeled, doing a DIR will display the label and show which partition is actually assigned that drive letter. A sample of this is shown in Figure 5.12 as Volume in drive D is Vista where Vista is the partition label as shown in Figure 1.2.

In most cases, C: is the Windows you want to pick when you boot to the XP Recovery Console. When you boot to the Vista DVD, C: will be the booting partition (the XP partition when setup the Microsoft way).

[Doctor Jellybean]

Right, I've hit a snag.

Everything went to plan, according to the Separating Vista and XP guide, up to step/figure 5.9

I could not proceed with the next step, as I don't know what partition Vista occupies. According to figure 5.3, the Location is unknown. According to BCDEDIT, partition is something DiskVolume2 or VolumeDisk2, can't remember the exact wording. So I manually went through each letter from C - K, no Vista.

According to Computer Management in Admin Tools, the Vista partition is K. XP (Programs) is on C.

http://i12.tinypic.com/6kfx1uh.jpg

Think I went wrong somewhere, maybe I should start from scratch?

[Doctor Jellybean]

Right, I've done some tinkering today.

First off, I inserted the Vista disc and selected Repair & Restart

http://i12.tinypic.com/6yf70p4.jpg

I still couldn't boot into Vista, and the Disk Management in Admin Tools (XP) showed this

http://i9.tinypic.com/85on1o6.jpg

I rebooted with the DD disc, and it confirmed it

http://i10.tinypic.com/8b6kqhx.jpg

Rebooted once more with Vista DVD, and selected Repair again.

http://i3.tinypic.com/89vvdk0.jpg

I selected Windows Vista (not the highlighted item as that is XP). After the repair, some details as displayed by the repair wizard

http://i17.tinypic.com/7xc7bk7.jpg

You can see what I meant that Vista occupies an unknown partition (HarddiskVolume2).

Rebooted once more, and the Vista boot menu now listed 2 Vistas

http://i15.tinypic.com/6q1ydfl.jpg

If I select the highlighted one, which is really XP, it tells me

http://i7.tinypic.com/80ng7kj.jpg

The other option boots me into Vista, no XP. I managed to fix that by booting with the XP disc and performed a fixboot repair. Of course, now I can't boot into Vista.

So, what now? Do I delete the Vista partition and install it again? But then I'll be back to where I started.

[MudCrab]

Your first screenshots show that the Vista partition is Hidden (it shouldn't be when doing those steps). Also, the "automatic" repair feature of the Vista DVD is limited it what it can do, which is why I recommend not using it and instead doing the steps manually. When following the steps in the Separation Guide, it's necessary to do the repairs manually as the "automatic" feature will run you in circles.

Boot into XP and check for Vista's booting files. These would be C:\bootmgr and the C:\boot folder. If they exist, you can delete them. We don't want Vista to detect them when you try to install.

When you reinstall Vista, make sure that you do the following steps.

Get XP booting normally (I think you already have this done).
Boot to the DD CD and start DD in Manual Mode.
Set the Vista partition Active. Apply the change.
Reformat the Vista partition to clear it.
Hide the XP partition. Apply the change.
Exit DD and reboot back to the DD CD. Start DD in Manual Mode.
Verify that the XP partition is Hidden and that the Vista partition is Active.
Remove the DD CD and insert the Vista DVD.
Reboot.
Press a key (if necessary) to boot the Vista DVD.
Proceed with the installation.
When you get to the partition selection screen, select the Vista partition (should be assigned as C:) and format it.
Make sure the Vista partition is still selected and proceed with the installation.
Vista should install and reboot properly.

At this point, you should be able to select which OS you want to boot by setting that partition Active and hiding the other one. You would do this using DD from the CD.

To reactivate OSS:

Boot to the DD CD and start DD in Manual Mode.
Make sure both the XP and Vista partitions are not hidden.
Set the Vista partition Active.
Apply the changes.
Reboot back to the DD CD and select the menu option to reactivate OSS.

You could also reactivate OSS by booting into Vista, installing DD and then installing OSS.

[Doctor Jellybean]

-{ Quote: "Boot into XP and check for Vista's booting files. These would be C:\bootmgr and the C:\boot folder. If they exist, you can delete them. We don't want Vista to detect them when you try to install." }-

They are there, but can't delete them (access denied). Same in Safe Mode.

-{ Quote: "When you reinstall Vista, make sure that you do the following steps.

Get XP booting normally (I think you already have this done).
Boot to the DD CD and start DD in Manual Mode.
Set the Vista partition Active. Apply the change.
Reformat the Vista partition to clear it.
Hide the XP partition. Apply the change.
Exit DD and reboot back to the DD CD. Start DD in Manual Mode.
Verify that the XP partition is Hidden and that the Vista partition is Active.
Remove the DD CD and insert the Vista DVD.
Reboot.
Press a key (if necessary) to boot the Vista DVD.
Proceed with the installation.
When you get to the partition selection screen, select the Vista partition (should be assigned as C:) and format it.
Make sure the Vista partition is still selected and proceed with the installation.
Vista should install and reboot properly.
" }-

It went all according to plan, up to the last point. When it reboots, I get the Vista Boot Manager

http://i15.tinypic.com/6q1ydfl.jpg

If I select the highlighted option, I get the following

http://i7.tinypic.com/80ng7kj.jpg

If I select the other option, it boots fine into Vista.

-{ Quote: "At this point, you should be able to select which OS you want to boot by setting that partition Active and hiding the other one. You would do this using DD from the CD.

To reactivate OSS:

Boot to the DD CD and start DD in Manual Mode.
Make sure both the XP and Vista partitions are not hidden.
Set the Vista partition Active.
Apply the changes.
Reboot back to the DD CD and select the menu option to reactivate OSS.

You could also reactivate OSS by booting into Vista, installing DD and then installing OSS." }-

Yep, this went fine. I get the Vista Boot Manager when selecting Vista (as above). Once in Vista, there is no sign of XP partition. If I select XP in OSS, it boots me straight into XP. No sign of Vista partition in XP.

Perhaps I can boot into Vista and use EasyBCD to edit the Vista Boot Manager and delete the XP entry, so the Boot Manager doesn't appear?

[MudCrab]

Can you post a screenshot of what Disk Management shows when you're booted into Vista?

Can you also post the output of the bcdedit command when run from Vista (make sure to start the Command Prompt in Administrator Mode)?

I want to make sure Vista is booting from the Vista partition and not from the XP partition.

[Doctor Jellybean]

Vista Disk Management

http://i7.tinypic.com/8331a1g.jpg


Vista bcdedit command output

http://i16.tinypic.com/72qive1.jpg


I noticed in the Disk Management that the XP partition has no volume label or drive letter.

[MudCrab]

Those both look good. Vista is setup correctly on the Vista partition as it should be. This means the problem is actually with OSS and the Vista booting files that remain on the XP partition.

You'll note that there is only one OS entry in the BCDEDIT screenshot and it (and the boot manager) are pointing to the C: partition. This is correct when viewed from Vista. You shouldn't need to do any BCD edits because the "real" BCD file on the Vista partition is correct.

------

If you can't delete the Vista booting files from the XP partition when booted into XP or when booted into XP's Safe Mode, you could try booting to the Vista DVD and using the Command Prompt. Make sure both the XP and Vista partitions are not hidden and that the Vista partition is Active. Make sure you DO NOT do any automatic repairs. If it tries to, cancel them. Remember, you'll have to use the attrib command to remove the Hidden, System and Read-Only flags before you can delete them.

You may be able to delete these files in XP if you use the attrib command on them. That way might be a little safer than using the Vista DVD. If you try it from XP, you'd want to run the following commands (<ENTER> means to press the ENTER key):
c: <ENTER>
cd \ <ENTER>
attrib -h -s -r c:\bootmgr <ENTER>
del bootmgr <ENTER>
attrib -h -s -r boot <ENTER>
cd boot <ENTER>
attrib -h -s -r *.* <ENTER>
cd .. <ENTER>
del boot <ENTER> (yes to prompt)
rd boot <ENTER>
Once those files are gone, delete the old Vista OSS menu entry as it will be invalid. Then see if OSS can detect the Vista installation on the Vista partition. If it doesn't, it can be added manually.

[Doctor Jellybean]

Thank you, that worked! No more Vista Boot Manager screen, and OSS works beautifully too. I had to use the Vista DVD to boot into and command prompt option to delete the required files/folders. Using the attrib command in XP safe mode gave me access denied error. Now all I have left to do is make a backup of the OSS and Vista partitions with TI, in case I need to reinstall Vista in the future without going through all the hoops.

[MudCrab]

-{ Quote: "Thank you, that worked! No more Vista Boot Manager screen, and OSS works beautifully too." }-
That's good to hear. Hopefully, you're all set now.
-{ Quote: "I had to use the Vista DVD to boot into and command prompt option to delete the required files/folders. Using the attrib command in XP safe mode gave me access denied error." }-
I kind of suspected that, but it was worth a shot.
-{ Quote: "Now all I have left to do is make a backup of the OSS and Vista partitions with TI, in case I need to reinstall Vista in the future without going through all the hoops." }-
Depending on the used space on your partitions and available backup space, you may want to consider creating an Entire Disk Image backup of the drive. Whenever I get a multi-boot system setup, I like to create a "base" Entire Disk Image so I have one that contains everything in a working state. Then I can restore that and any newer partition images as necessary.

[Doctor Jellybean]

One last question:

If and when I'm happy with the way Vista runs, I may get rid of XP. Therefore I would not need OSS. Would the following steps be the correct ones to take?

1) Deactivate OSS
2) Delete OSS partition (got seperate partition for OSS bootloader)
3) Boot with DD disc, make sure Vista partition is active.
4) Format XP partition and set to visible.

[MudCrab]

You should be able to just uninstall OSS and select which OS you want to be the default (Vista, in your case). Then you can do what you want with the other partitions.