Anti-Malware Test Lab and AV-Comparatives.org announce alliance

[A_Shabanov]

Friends, i suggest to you fresh news:

"The renowned test labs Anti-Malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com) and AV-Comparatives.org (http://www.av-comparatives.org) have agreed to establish a strategic partnership.

The alliance will allow the partners to become one of the most respected sources of objective and independent information about antivirus products and strengthen their position in the industry. It will also give independent tests and expert analyses more weight.

Within the framework of the alliance, Anti-Malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com) and AV-Comparatives.org (http://www.av-comparatives.org) plan to create a unified set of antivirus software tests and to join forces in improving testing methodologies, assembling test collections and interpreting test results for the public.

Anti-Malware Test Lab and AV-Comparatives.org intend to create a unique system of integrated tests for antivirus solutions by the end of 2008. This signals a marked shift to a new level of software assessment, since users currently only have recourse to tests based on individual protection components.

"We are very pleased to have reached an alliance agreement with AV-Comparatives.org. Our labs are the first to start the process of consolidating the work of the various independent centers that test information security products. I’m sure that our partnership will act as a driving force for the development of the industry as a whole," commented Sergey Ilyin, founder of Anti-Malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com).

"The partnership with Anti-Malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com) will allow us to evaluate more aspects of antivirus software and to offer users a more comprehensive independent view of various security products. If the alliance prove itself to be valuable, we will consider collaboration with more test centers worldwide, though all of us will remain independent," said Andreas Clementi, the founder of AV-Comparatives.org (http://www.av-comparatives.org) .

Anti-Malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com) is an independent test laboratory. The test lab is a subsidiary of Anti-Malware.ru (http://www.anti-malware.ru), an authoritative Russian analytical portal devoted to software products that provide protection against various types of malicious code. The laboratory is best known for its testing of active infection treatments, antivirus self-protection, as well as the effectiveness of anti-rootkit and proactive protection.

AV-Comparatives.org (http://www.av-comparatives.org) , founded by Andreas Clementi and located in Austria, is one of the most reputed and respected independent anti-virus software test labs in the world. The antivirus testing for on-demand and retrospective/proactive detection rate of malicious programs has earned it market-wide recognition. Other currently delivered tests cover false alarm rates, scan speed, polymorphic virus detection, etc. "

Now, you can read about this news here:
1) About alliance - Av-comparatives.org (http://www.av-comparatives.org/weblog/?p=93)
2) About alliance - Anti-malware Test Lab (http://www.anti-malware-test.com/?q=node/49)

I am very interested your views on this matter :)

[sergeyko]

Too bad. :-X

[Jadda]

-{ Quote: "Too bad. :-X" }-

May I ask why? ;)

[Mele20]

-{ Quote: "May I ask why? ;)" }-

I think because DrWeb, along with F-Prot, declined to participate in the most recent AV-Comparatives tests. There is a long thread here about why both declined. (A very interesting thread that everyone should read).

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=199292&highlight=DrWeb+AV+comparatives

[C.S.J]

I don't think drweb will be very happy about this,

Is partnership, another word for influence.

Will av-comparatives be influencing the results and testing of anti-malware.ru?

[trjam]

As I always say,"If you cant whup-em, join-em.";)

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "As I always say,"If you cant whup-em, join-em.";)" }-
Or, when there's no evidence, resort to insidious allegations.

[JimGoo]

Oh well, there goes the neighborhood. Looks like we'll have to rely solely on PC Magazine and PC World reviews from now on.

;D

Regards,
Jim

[kinwolf]

-{ Quote: "Will av-comparatives be influencing the results and testing of anti-malware.ru?" }-


And why wouldn't it be the other way around? Maybe something really good will come out of this.

[C.S.J]

yes, it could be but until I know, got that weary feeling.

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "yes, it could be but until I know, got that weary feeling." }-
And why is that?

Are there any past events or precedents to indicate unscrupulousness on AV-C's part?

Or is this just another one of your many "opinions"?

[sergeyko]

-{ Quote: "May I ask why? ;)" }-

Well, I don't think this alliance will be any good to anyone. Besides Anti-Malware and AV-Comparatives.org, of course.
I don't think it'll make them any better in testing or add them any piece of independance.
Both of them will feel more significant in this world. Have that ever brought something good?

I can't see any other reason for such an alliance.

[trjam]

Gimme a A
Gimme a E
Gimme a V
Gimme a S
Gimme a I
Gimme a E
Gimme a R
Gimme a T
Gimme a A

Whats that spell? Go Avira and Eset.

Hmm, no Dr Web in it.:-\

[s4u]

You funny guy

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "I can't see any other reason for such an alliance." }-
So why don't you ask them?

I also see no reason for you to take every opportunity to take potshots at them, but unlike you, I'm extending the courtesy to you to ask you why. What is it that you have against IBK, exactly? If there are valid reasons - do tell.

[trjam]

Sorry solcroft, think he just hit the "Log Out" button.:dry:

[solcroft]

Wouldn't be the first time.

[IBK]

av-c will just support amtl by making them more popular. we will both remain independent also from each other, but if amtl wants too, they can use our results and viceversa. i do not see anything bad in supporting other smaller testers.

[Banshee]

-{ Quote: "So why don't you ask them?

I also see no reason for you to take every opportunity to take potshots at them, but unlike you, I'm extending the courtesy to you to ask you why. What is it that you have against IBK, exactly? If there are valid reasons - do tell." }-


Solcroft, I think they already said what they don't like in another thread awhile back. If you want valid reasons I have the feeling you won't get any besides the usual misinformation and propaganda floating around on a regular basis.

Let's see what happens::)

[sergeyko]

-{ Quote: "So why don't you ask them? " }-

Do I need to? No, thanks. They asked for opinions they've got mine.

-{ Quote: "I also see no reason for you to take every opportunity to take potshots at them, but unlike you, I'm extending the courtesy to you to ask you why. What is it that you have against IBK, exactly? If there are valid reasons - do tell." }-

Wow a tough talk!
Why do you think I have anything against him? I just don't think his test gives a real picture. That's it.

What you call "every opportunity to take potshots at them" is just your imagination, or maybe you just mixed me up with someone else. Look through my posts, there are not many of them here, I wrote about drweb mostly.

-{ Quote: "Wouldn't be the first time." }-

Have I pushed you when we met? ;)

[C.S.J]

maybe he means me Sergey,

but I don't see his messages ;)

FYI - I have absolutely nothing against ibk, he's alright to talk to for sure.

[Dorn]

-{ Quote: "

Why do you think I have anything against him? I just don't think his test gives a real picture. That's it.

;)" }-

+2 Count me on this too, i really dont belive in his av test eather.
Dont have anything against him.
But really confuised, its just a man alone and we dont have any guarantee if his test is correct to 100%.

[IBK]

one man alone? you have obviously no idea what you are talking about.

[sergeyko]

-{ Quote: "one man alone? you have obviously no idea what you are talking about." }-

Well, let's rephrase "But really confuised, its just 5 men alone and we dont have any guarantee if their test is correct to 100%." ;)
Does it really matter?

You cannot deny the AV tests need improving, if not say complete changing. You too participate in that process and that's not out of the blue.

[IBK]

Did I deny?
Which tester gives a 100,0% guarantee? Which software developer gives 100% guarantee about his software (without lying i mean)?
btw, 8 is the correct number atm.

[Dorn]

if there is a little group that really dont belive in av test then let them , why force them and try to brainwash them..
Always we hear IBK made the test and bla, never heard of any other man.
Still even if there were 10 men, there are some group of people that really dont belive it, and it just shows that people should not belive in avcomparatives since you try to make them belive in it, thats why avcomparatives is fake according to many users.

[IBK]

i do not like disinformation. clarifying things has nothing to do with brainwash.
btw, some few other involved peoples are listed on the website.

[kinwolf]

-{ Quote: "if there is a little group that really dont belive in av test then let them , why force them and try to brainwash them..
Always we hear IBK made the test and bla, never heard of any other man.
Still even if there were 10 men, there are some group of people that really dont belive it, and it just shows that people should not belive in avcomparatives since you try to make them belive in it, thats why avcomparatives is fake according to many users." }-

I think it's only normal that IBK reply to defend his test when some people take shot at it. What if I was to tell you you cheated in some test. Would you say nothing to defend yourself if you knew it was false? Brainwash is a bit of a strong term too, I hever never seen any type of brainwashing done here.

While I personally think there is room for improvement in av-comparative test bed, I am still very glad it exist.

[trjam]

Dorn, you and you spider finactics need to provide some sort of proof or shut the hell up. You cant just make public assumptions or accusations without proof. Well, I guess for Dr Web that is SOP.:thumbd:

[Dorn]

ok ok sorry but thats just my though , and some other users in here.
:blink:

[trjam]

I am sorry I acted, but this crap comes up all the time and no one provides anything but speculation. IBK isnt perfect, and as he said, neither are AV products. But just like the vendors, he is looking at how to make things even better and until we see the results of this merger, we should all hold back judgement. Geez, folks, give it a chance before you bury it.

[C.S.J]

jeff there is no merger, the tests will remain separate from each other, its only for promotion

[trjam]

then why are we even concerned. My apologies to the Web. The reality is none of us have a crystal ball, so we dont know if this is good or bad. Maybe a year from now we can all look back and speculate on facts presented, instead of a future unknown.

[Sergey Ilyin]

Hi everybody! Just some of my comments about the new alliance.

As IBK has already written before my test lab and AV-Comparatives.org both will remain independence. All kinds of tests surely will be done as usually in a regular base. The alliance will allow partners to share testing results, knowledge etc. Also together we have more capabilities to growth, to create really reliable testing methodologies, quality publications, whatever you want.

As for DrWeb this antivirus will be always included in our test because this is one of the key products for Russia and CIS markets. All our public tests are free of charge for AV vendors.

P.S. Anti-Malware Test Lab is not so small as you suppose ;)

[egghead]

Hello "Sergey",

Welcome to this forum.

Now you have posted a picture of yourself you can drop your pseudonym. ;)

Glad to read that you will keep testing the Doctor.

[sergeyko]

-{ Quote: "
As for DrWeb this antivirus will be always included in our test because this is one of the key products for Russia and CIS markets. All our public tests are free of charge for AV vendors.
" }-

What a nice surprise! :))

I cannot understand why my, ok said aloud opinion, was treated as opposition of drweb to antimalware. Sergey, why?
Anyway, thanks for your kindness :)

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "Do I need to? No, thanks. They asked for opinions they've got mine.

Wow a tough talk!
Why do you think I have anything against him? I just don't think his test gives a real picture. That's it." }-
You're certainly welcome to your opinion. But when your opinions seem to be mostly allegations against another, I'd like to know just exactly just what your opinions are based on. So that we can all be wary of these shady characters if there are valid reasons for your opinion, or we can ignore you and your load of bull if there aren't.

[Macstorm]

Goood neewwss :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

I wonder how would some people take this news, those who were bashing the AMTL tests sometime ago ::)

[Macstorm]

-{ Quote: "av-c will just support amtl by making them more popular. we will both remain independent also from each other, but if amtl wants too, they can use our results and viceversa. i do not see anything bad in supporting other smaller testers." }-
Actually i thought it was the other way around, being AV-C the smallest ;D

[joking]

[C.S.J]

-{ Quote: "then why are we even concerned." }-
who is concerned?

my mind was eased as soon as IBK posted, i see no reason why he would lie or try to trick people.

people take all this too seriously, but... thats wilders for ya :)

but still, this place wouldnt be the same without the over-concerning people and disagreements.

i for one, wouldnt even know about certain products, hadn't i arrived on wilders, and i think the same would apply for most people.

looks like im all-russian now with my security, i suppose this aint a bad thing with all the malware and Spam Russia create.
i remember reading in ComputerActive last month that Russia have increased the most for Spam (although the USA still leads as the ultimate spammer) and Russia also actually distribute the most bots and malware circulation.

i remember a certain someone mentioning on here, "when you go to Russia, you dont need to look for Malware, Malware finds you"

so hopefully, im in good hands. :)

[Soujirou]

I think this is great news. Any type of collaboration, even if only for publicity leads to increased interaction that will yield a better product on both ends. While both labs have different approaches to testing, I do not think Anti-Malware would team up with AV Comparitives if they thought they were out to lunch. Anti-Malware definitely needs more publicity because their testing is more useful for people who want greater detail about AV's.

[JerryM]

As for me, I will continue to have high confidence in IBK and his work until I have some clear reason to change. I bet there will be no reason for me to change my opinion.

It is still true that, "You couldn't please some folks if you hung em with a new rope."

Best,
Jerry

[trjam]

-{ Quote: "As for me, I will continue to have high confidence in IBK and his work until I have some clear reason to change. I bet there will be no reason for me to change my opinion.

It is still true that, "You couldn't please some folks if you hung em with a new rope."

Best,
Jerry" }-
as always Jerry, you took the words right out of my mouth. ;) Got your email and thanks.

[The Hammer]

-{ Quote: "I think because DrWeb, along with F-Prot, declined to participate in the most recent AV-Comparatives tests. There is a long thread here about why both declined. (A very interesting thread that everyone should read).

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=199292&highlight=DrWeb+AV+comparatives" }-I don't see any discussion of F-Prot in this thread , it seems to be all Dr. Web.

[lucas1985]

There are posts from Frisk's employees.

[Firecat]

-{ Quote: "I don't see any discussion of F-Prot in this thread , it seems to be all Dr. Web." }-
See the posts from users Frisk, bontchev and Inspector Clouseau :)

[C.S.J]

-{ Quote: "See the posts from users Frisk, bontchev and Inspector Clouseau :)" }-
it should be said, they are 'personal opinions', not speaking on behalf of Frisk.

i dont like that thread, makes me sound just like a basher of IBK directly.

while i may have my own opinions about these 'big tests' of 1 million malware, and i aint too shy to share my opinions, as most of you know, however wild or crazy some may think or whatever, its not just IBK and his tests, but also Av-test too.

its these 'type' of testing, not the testers directly.

maybe IBK does get pissed off as im sure he holds his work close to heart, but my opinions which i do admit do sometimes go 'over the top', are my own and are NOT directed towards Andreas/Andreas but on these sort of tests alone.

obviously, its IBK and his tests that most of the comments get related too, as his tests are more popular and he is a regular visit to the forum.

just had to clear that up :)

i have many theorys about what 'really goes on', and i dont hesitate to think that both the testers and the companys keep information withheld.

we'll see what the future brings....

people take all this security way too far :)

[Macstorm]

-{ Quote: "i have many theorys about what 'really goes on', and i dont hesitate to think that both the testers and the companys keep information withheld." }-
What kind of info Chris? don't be shy and share your thoughts ;)

[LowWaterMark]

Let me just caution people about posting wildly speculative theories here though, as happened in the other thread. If you have statements to make, be sure you back them up with facts, and not just something you think makes sense by "all that has not been said" or such similar lines of reasoning. We will not allow defamatory comments, or those that aren't based in facts to be posted here.

[bellgamin]

-{ Quote: "Let me just caution people about posting wildly speculative theories..." }-aka "defamation by insinuation."

As I understand it, AMTL & AV-C will share databases, but will remain independent otherwise. If so, good!

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "What kind of info Chris? don't be shy and share your thoughts ;)" }-
Info? Hah.

You're giving him too much credit. He's got theories at best, and he says so himself. And as far as I'm concerned, the adjective used to describe them is an 8-letter word starting with 'c' and ending with 't'.

[bellgamin]

-{ Quote: "...8-letter word starting with 'c' and ending with 't'." }-I looove crossword puzzles. Let's see -- an 8-letter word that begins with "c" & ends with "t" and applies to Chris?

No doubt-- it's gotta be "chitchat"!!! :D

Yep, Chris enjoys participating in chitchat. Me, too. So... why not mellow out, solly old bean? 8)

[Macstorm]

-{ Quote: "Info? Hah.

You're giving him too much credit. He's got theories at best, and he says so himself. And as far as I'm concerned, the adjective used to describe them is an 8-letter word starting with 'c' and ending with 't'." }-
You are sometimes a bit rude to people Solcroft.. :lurking:

By the way, may i have your opinion about this forthcoming AMTL & AV-C alliance?

[solcroft]

-{ Quote: "I looove crossword puzzles. Let's see -- an 8-letter word that begins with "c" & ends with "t" and applies to Chris?

No doubt-- it's gotta be "chitchat"!!! :D

Yep, Chris enjoys participating in chitchat. Me, too. So... why not mellow out, solly old bean? 8)" }-
Okay, I'm impressed. ;D

[ronjor]

One off topic post removed. Please check the thread title before posting.

[Kees1958]

-{ Quote: "Did I deny?
Which tester gives a 100,0% guarantee? Which software developer gives 100% guarantee about his software (without lying i mean)?
" }-

True,

With a fixed set of functionality and a limited data domain programmers, are not able to write perfect code (off course) and testers are not able to test all the theoretical paths (for reasons of money and human errors).

AV tester has the problem that he/she has to collect available test set them selves. So there is a reason behind enlarging the (economy of) scale and specialising on certain test aspects (like self protection). It all adds to a better valuation of the software.

Given this I am very happy with the tests. Personally I would like to know the scores devided in zoo and wild samples. I also would like to know the number of FP's with heuristics tests (as a percentage when it is a secret).

Regards Kees