AVG version 8 package Installs the yahoo toolbar

[GuidoSmith]

Tip:
AVG version 8 package Installs the yahoo toolbar
:-(

[JonPaulOnLine]

another software I will never install

I do not like unwanted toolbar's

[robinb]

do it as a custom install and you can uncheck it. this is used for the linksystem and webshield.

robin

[Jadda]

You get to choose of you want to install it or not.

[Corrine]

-{ Quote: "another software I will never install

I do not like unwanted toolbar's" }-
I'm with you, JonPaul! I detest toolbars.

Granted, as robinb wrote, users can uncheck the default toolbar install. Seeing as how one of the things we see often in "our business" is people complaining about a toolbar showing up on their browser, we know they easily miss those default check boxes.

From what I have been able to ascertain, version 8 is the paid version only, although a free trial is available. The links to the "free for personal use" versions of their software remain at 7.5:

AVG Anti-Virus Free Edition 7.5 (http://free.grisoft.com/doc/downloads?prd=aff)

AVG Anti-Spyware Free Edition 7.5 (http://free.grisoft.com/doc/5390/us/frt/0?prd=asf) (Grisoft)
AVG Anti-Spyware 7.5 (http://www.ewido.net/en/download/) (ewido)

AVG Anti-Rootkit Free (http://free.grisoft.com/doc/5390/us/frt/0?prd=arw)

[Corrine]

Oopsie! It appears that robinb is incorrect. In doing a bit of reading, I see from the thread at CoU (http://www.dozleng.com/updates/index.php?showtopic=17486&st=0&#entry76177) the Yahoo toolbar is installed even when UNchecked.

That does make me angry. Isn't the license fee enough? How has it gotten to the point where even the security software vendors are untrustworthy?

[C.S.J]

i like the toolbar, its not too intrusive and seems to offer extra protection.

active surf-shield and search-shield?


198151

[kodl]

-{ Quote: "Oopsie! It appears that robinb is incorrect. In doing a bit of reading, I see from the thread at CoU (http://www.dozleng.com/updates/index.php?showtopic=17486&st=0&#entry76177) the Yahoo toolbar is installed even when UNchecked.

That does make me angry. Isn't the license fee enough? How has it gotten to the point where even the security software vendors are untrustworthy?" }-
The information is not correct. The toolbar can easily be uninstalled and does not get installed at all if you do not want it and uncheck the appropriate option. The toolbar is not a 'Yahoo search toolbar' but rather a tool to give you easy access to the new Search and Surf protection from within the browser, where you will most likely need them most. Still, the protection is available even without the toolbar so if you don't like it, you do not have to install it

[C.S.J]

i really like the overall package and its definatly an improvement on 7.5, so in that case.... better is always, erm... better. :)

[Corrine]

-{ Quote: "The toolbar can easily be uninstalled and does not get installed at all if you do not want it and uncheck the appropriate option." }-
Certainly the toolbar can be removed -- if the user has that type of experience. However, the money for the install is most likely already lining the pockets of AVG management.

The posters in the thread at CoU are not inexperienced. If they said they unchecked the toolbar, I believe them. If the linked image isn't a "Yahoo search toolbar", you tell me what it is. It certainly looks like Yahoo to me.

198173

-{ Quote: "the protection is available even without the toolbar " }-

So why install the Yahoo search toolbar in the first place? Ah, yes, indeed, the license fee apparently isn't enough to satisfy the money-grubbers in the business world. pfffffffft I will stick with honest folks like Bill Pytlovany (http://billpstudios.blogspot.com/2008/03/iac-may-say-good-bye-askcom-toolbar.html) (WinPatrol) who place integrity above the almighty dollar.

[LoneWolf]

-{ Quote: "another software I will never install

I do not like unwanted toolbar's" }-

Agreed.
Unwanted toolbars suck. :thumbd:

[TeMerc]

Looks like yet another vendor for me to remove from my affiliates list and my recommended list as well.

Tho I suppose we could give them some time to see if they come to thier senses.

But I'm not hopeful, usually the afore mentioned $$$ lined pockets win out.

[C.S.J]

people are really making a big deal over nothing.

[cdr]

:) I am also testing this out, having upgraded my AVG Anti-Spyware to version 8.0 (now my program says "AVG Anti-Spyware Professional Edition" in the corner, but it is actually the Antivirus Program, which includes the previous Anti-Spyware Program!). The Yahoo toolbar is installed; however, if I go to View-->Toolbars, then uncheck Yahoo toolbar, it is not displayed. But the important thing is that if I then use my normal Google search bar to search for something, the sites that are listed still have an AVG icon next to them indicating whether each one is safe to click on or not! So, if I don't like the Yahoo toolbar and don't want to see it or use it, I just hide that toolbar and use my normal search bar--with the same safety check by AVG. I don't find this to be too bad! I like seeing the little green safety status icon next to each site listed on the page. So far, I happen to like the AVG program.

[robinb]

-{ Quote: "Oopsie! It appears that robinb is incorrect. In doing a bit of reading, I see from the thread at CoU (http://www.dozleng.com/updates/index.php?showtopic=17486&st=0&#entry76177) the Yahoo toolbar is installed even when UNchecked.

That does make me angry. Isn't the license fee enough? How has it gotten to the point where even the security software vendors are untrustworthy?" }-

nope not true.
I installed it and made sure the check mark was not on and I also did a custom install and removed the webshield and the linkshield because they are making firefox and ie7 go very slow.

Maybe that person thought he unchecked it but the best way to do this is to do it as a custom install not a typical.

robin

[Ade 1]

-{ Quote: ":) however, if I go to View-->Toolbars, then uncheck Yahoo toolbar, it is not displayed." }-

Yep...exactly what I have done (unchecked AVG Toolbar). So, yeah, no big deal really.

[Corrine]

-{ Quote: "I installed it and made sure the check mark was not on and I also did a custom install and removed the webshield and the linkshield because they are making firefox and ie7 go very slow.

Maybe that person thought he unchecked it but the best way to do this is to do it as a custom install not a typical." }-
Proving that installing AVG 8.0 without the Yahoo Search Bar is not a clear-cut option as the majority of people do not do a custom install. Furthermore, as you stated, apparently the software with a "normal" installation interfers with both IE7 and Firefox.

[NonSuch]

-{ Quote: "Proving that installing AVG 8.0 without the Yahoo Search Bar is not a clear-cut option as the majority of people do not do a custom install. Furthermore, as you stated, apparently the software with a "normal" installation interfers with both IE7 and Firefox." }-

I'm with you, Corrine. You know how I feel about foistware. It's bad enough in a free product, and intolerable in a paid-for product. Of course, since AVG Anti-spyware will no longer be available as a standalone product, I won't be using it after my paid subscription runs out anyway. 8)

[C.S.J]

no, its just selfish to think that just because you dont want it, others wont either.

you dont have to use the toolbar, as staff have already mentioned in this thread.

the choice is yours.

[LoneWolf]

-{ Quote: "no, its just selfish to think that just because you dont want it, others wont either.

you dont have to use the toolbar, as staff have already mentioned in this thread.

the choice is yours." }-

I understand your point C.S.J but......
If I want a toolbar i'll download toolbar.
If I want a security app i'll download a security app.
(But I don't want a toolbar)

[C.S.J]

you dont have to have the toolbar, i think the majority of people would at least prefer to be offered a choice.

same goes for suites with/without parental control, even though i dont want it, id still prefer a suite to have it because there will be users who do want/need it, as long as there is an option to choose not to install it, im happy, this is the same with AVG 8.0 ;)

[robinb]

-{ Quote: "Proving that installing AVG 8.0 without the Yahoo Search Bar is not a clear-cut option as the majority of people do not do a custom install. Furthermore, as you stated, apparently the software with a "normal" installation interfers with both IE7 and Firefox." }-


that is correct- that is why while in beta we told grisoft to fix this and i am clueless why they did not.

Maybe if enough people who install it fully find their browsers slow down and they email support they will come out with a fixed version

I hope so.

robin

[mfenech]

-{ Quote: "you dont have to have the toolbar, i think the majority of people would at least prefer to be offered a choice. same goes for suites with/without parental control, even though i dont want it, id still prefer a suite to have it because there will be users who do want/need it, as long as there is an option to choose not to install it, im happy, this is the same with AVG 8.0 ;)" }-
Are you comparing a parental control feature in a security suite with a toolbar that's nothing more than advertisement? ???

[Firebytes]

-{ Quote: "you dont have to have the toolbar, i think the majority of people would at least prefer to be offered a choice." }-

If AVG really wanted to "offer a choice" on the toolbar they could at least advise/warn users in a screen before the custom and typical install screen that they need to opt out of the toolbar install if they do not want it. Without that warning most users will do a typical install and never even know they had the option. Or if it is defaulted to unchecked the ones who might actually have wanted it will not get it. Which way does the toolbar default anyway, checked/unchecked? I have read both so i don't know.

I personally wouldn't have installed the new AVG anyway since it is a suite but I would have still respected them as a quality software. Not now though since they incorporated a third party toolbar. :thumbd:

[NonSuch]

-{ Quote: "no, its just selfish to think that just because you dont want it, others wont either.

you dont have to use the toolbar, as staff have already mentioned in this thread.

the choice is yours." }-

Just because one may not be forced to install a toolbar does not, in my opinion, make it alright for a vendor to include such a toolbar in a paid product, especially since it is admittedly not needed for the proper operation of the product.

The toolbar is not a necessity, nor was it necessary to integrate AVG-AS into AVG anti-virus and then tell paying customers that the only way they can continue to use AVG Anti-Spyware, for which they may have a long-term paid subscription, is if they dump their current anti-virus product and downgrade to AVG anti-virus.

Yes, everyone has a choice. It's certainly the choice of the vendor to discontinue AVG-AS as a standalone product, and it's their choice to bundle AVG-AS with AVG-AV and include a toolbar. However, it would appear they're making business decisions that will give many paying customers more reason to choose to avoid their products than to use them.

[Smokey]

-{ Quote: "The posters in the thread at CoU are not inexperienced. If they said they unchecked the toolbar, I believe them. If the linked image isn't a "Yahoo search toolbar", you tell me what it is. It certainly looks like Yahoo to me. " }-
Tested and confirmed by a humble, inexperienced bear ;)

[Thug21]

Me and AVG products go back many, many years, but this time I am both surprised and disappointed with Grisoft. Maybe I'm having a memory lapse but I don't think I saw any toolbar in the beta's, etc. :dry:

Yeah, it's only a toolbar, but why should they include it?? Why it's it NOT explicitly labeled as Yahoo! but rather some seemingly essential security feature for the webguard?

Didn't security companies used to help rid us of unwanted BHO's? And do we need that Yahoo! waste of space in our browser?

I guess we should be happy at least it isn't the famous ASK toolbar but still...:dry:

And no, I do NOT want a trusted security product I payed for to try and set my default search provider for me!

[RejZoR]

I don't understand whats with everyone and with their stupid toolbars.
If i'd want one, i'd find it myself and install it. But i belive NO ONE wants these stupid toolbars. ::) So stop bundling them gee...

Daemon tools, Nero, AVG etc, i'm really waiting for this junk to be bundled with icons...

[C.S.J]

-{ Quote: "Are you comparing a parental control feature in a security suite with a toolbar that's nothing more than advertisement? ???" }-
whether its an advertisment or not, the choice is in the installation whether you want it or not, so the choice is yours. You need to understand that some people will like and want the toolbar.

yes, i am comparing it to parental control, eg. i never want parental control, yet some suites dont even have an option to not install it, so users are forced to add 50+ ram usage and a massive drag on their internet connection, the toolbar uses zero resources and a choice to not even see/use/install it,

in simple terms, stop bitching

it is what it is. ;)

[Firebytes]

Aww, we can't state the things we dislike about programs on here anymore because they are what they are? Dang!:o

[robinb]

it is real interesting about this toolbar because in the beta there was no toolbar anything upon installation and we beta tested the full enterprise suite. This must have been a last minute thing to put this on. Maybe they were waiting for approval from Yahoo.

If we had gotten to test it I would bet we all would have voted against it.
I also feel there should have been a box prior to the one with the message for the toolbar giving you a better choice whether to install it or not.
I am betting most people will not even know it is there or when seeing it checked (it is checked by default) will not realize to uncheck it. The only way to get rid of it after the install would be to reinstall over, do a add/repair and do a custom install and then wait for that screen and uncheck it.

robin

[Nuke]

I preferred not to have the toolbar. It just seems to clutter things up and I will never use it!

[midway40]

Norton also gives you the option of installing this (http://www.symantec.com/norton/themes/yahoo_toolbar/index.jsp) toolbar at the beginning of the installation. But it is not the same toolbar pictured on the site. It is just a regular Yahoo toolbar with no Symantec branding on it. Talk about false advertising, lol.

At least AVG's toolbar has some security elements included.

[innerpeace]

-{ Quote: "whether its an advertisment or not, the choice is in the installation whether you want it or not, so the choice is yours. You need to understand that some people will like and want the toolbar." }-
And some people like and paid for a security program and that's what they should get. Nothing more.

-{ Quote: "yes, i am comparing it to parental control, eg. i never want parental control, yet some suites dont even have an option to not install it, so users are forced to add 50+ ram usage and a massive drag on their internet connection, the toolbar uses zero resources and a choice to not even see/use/install it," }-
Ummm, you paid for a security application that included a parental control feature. Did you also pay for the Yahoo toolbar? Think about who's getting paid here...

-{ Quote: "in simple terms, stop bitching

it is what it is. ;)" }-
Folks are just voicing their opinions, I hope that's ok. Most users at Wilder's keep clean computers and only install what we need. I had a chance to have a look at a typical users computer not too long ago. I can honestly say, I don't think they need or could use another toolbar.

This is all about money. Perhaps they can give a discount IF someone installs the toolbar version of AVG. I really don't see that happening though ;)

[LoneWolf]

-{ Quote: "

in simple terms, stop bitching

it is what it is. ;)" }-

Bitching.........bitching...........you wanna hear bitching, hold on, let me go get the wife. ::) ;D

[DVD+R]

Ok lets make this clear :dry: If you do not check the install toobar box, It wont be installed. If you doubt this, check your registry editor for any signs of Yahoo Toolbar, But you wont find any! :shifty:

[Thug21]

No reason for it in the first place. :lurking:
I don't want Yahoo payin' AVG...

[C.S.J]

-{ Quote: "Ok lets make this clear :dry: If you do not check the install toobar box, It wont be installed. If you doubt this, check your registry editor for any signs of Yahoo Toolbar, But you wont find any! :shifty:" }-
exactly! ;)

[C.S.J]

-{ Quote: "Ummm, you paid for a security application that included a parental control feature. Did you also pay for the Yahoo toolbar? Think about who's getting paid here...

" }-
actually, you pay for a licence that includes those features but newer versions can include other things.

it is also your choice to upgrade, and also your choice whether to install the toolbar or not during installation.


payment subscription, it is for the licence/signature updates and support.

[stapp]

-{ Quote: "
it is also your choice to upgrade" }-

I don't know that I would agree with that sentence. All I want is to be able to continue paying for this great little piece of software that causes me zero hassles.

Instead I am told it will end.

I have a firewall.

I have an av.

All I want is to keep avg antispy 7.5.

I have a choice?

[innerpeace]

-{ Quote: "actually, you pay for a licence that includes those features but newer versions can include other things.

it is also your choice to upgrade, and also your choice whether to install the toolbar or not during installation.


payment subscription, it is for the licence/signature updates and support." }-
I'm aware that it's a choice, so isn't carefully reading the EULA. I'm just thinking of all the folks who click ok,ok,ok while installing software. I also think that one should be able to click ok repeatably when installing "trusted security software".

I'm in the mindset that if we allow a toolbar to be installed with a security suite then what will they attempt next?

innerpeace

[avg_fan]

Okay, so I found installing AVG Internet Security 8.0 using the default settings also installs the AVG toolbar. But then the AVG toolbar can be easily uninstalled if I decide it's not wanted. So no real issue.

If I go the custom install route I get to choose if I want the AVG toolbar. If I choose not to install it, it isn't installed. That's as it should be.

I guess it's a "Yahoo" toolbar in that Yahoo is the search engine in the toolbar. But the AVG toolbar actually gives me quick access to AVG settings and security information, especially the LinkScanner Surf-Shield and Search-Shield settings.

In fact the AVG toolbar actually gives me access to some LinkScanner settings that I can't access via the Advanced Settings options in AVG itself. (I can't see where the Ratings options can be set within AVG itself. Or have I missed something?)

So I'll leave the AVG toolbar on. No doubt the AVG toolbar will become more feature rich in subsequent updates.

[Biscuit]

That's the last nail in the coffin for AVG from my point of view. Installing toolbars is disgusting spyware-type behaviour.

[NonSuch]

-{ Quote: "So I'll leave the AVG toolbar on. No doubt the AVG toolbar will become more feature rich in subsequent updates." }-

It certainly should become "more feature rich," considering that AVG receives payment for putting it on your system... I can believe they would want to make it as enticing as possible,,, If you're going to catch fish, you need to put "bait" on your hook. ::)

[BuzzStone]

I totally agree with you C.S.J. Be careful all of you 'cause the FBI, CIA, IRS and ATF are closely monitoring your activities, not to mention Microsoft and Mozilla. You are doomed, lol.

[rdsok]

-{ Quote: "That's the last nail in the coffin for AVG from my point of view. Installing toolbars is disgusting spyware-type behaviour." }-

I'm sorry but this and similar posts trying to state the same are either the biggest load of baloney that I've ever read or just posted by the completely ignorant.

Yes, its is true that some spyware install toolbars... but not all toolbars are spyware related. Yes its true that some BHO's are installed by spyware... but again not all BHO's are installed by spyware as a matter of fact many very useful normal programs install them.

As a matter of fact, I know of a lot of registry cleaners that are spyware related ... If the logic used in the above about toolbars were to be used, then suddenly all registry cleaners would now be classified as such.

I certainly can understand why users may not want to add a toolbar but to use such illogical statements as this to try and validate these users objections to them is simply ludicrous.

If you don't want the toolbar... don't install it. After all its optional unlike what you would actually see in a real spyware related toolbar.

[NonSuch]

-{ Quote: "I'm sorry but this and similar posts trying to state the same are either the biggest load of baloney that I've ever read or just posted by the completely ignorant.

Yes, its is true that some spyware install toolbars... but not all toolbars are spyware related. Yes its true that some BHO's are installed by spyware... but again not all BHO's are installed by spyware as a matter of fact many very useful normal programs install them.

As a matter of fact, I know of a lot of registry cleaners that are spyware related ... If the logic used in the above about toolbars were to be used, then suddenly all registry cleaners would now be classified as such.

I certainly can understand why users may not want to add a toolbar but to use such illogical statements as this to try and validate these users objections to them is simply ludicrous.

If you don't want the toolbar... don't install it. After all its optional unlike what you would actually see in a real spyware related toolbar." }-

The toolbar is presented as though it is a needed or highly desirable option. It is not properly disclosed that it is a Yahoo search bar and that part of its purpose is to generate additional profits for the vendor. Without proper disclosure, the consumer cannot make an informed choice.

Many people will not object to freeware offering a search bar; however, it is another story entirely when one has purchased a product and then they find that a search toolbar has been foisted upon them, without their informed consent, in order that the vendor may reap additional profits.

As a longtime computer consultant, technician, and Microsoft MVP in the area of Consumer Security, I can assure you that the concerns expressed here are most assuredly not "baloney." It is quite possible that you are just failing to grasp the gravity of the situation, or perhaps the concerns expressed may strike a nerve due to your own interests.

[mfenech]

-{ Quote: "It is quite possible that you are just failing to grasp the gravity of the situation, or perhaps the concerns expressed may strike a nerve due to your own interests." }-
Couldn't have expressed it better myself. Thank you.

[djohn]

trying it out now,no problem with security tool bar it clearly ask if want to install it is checked by default. simply uncheck box no tool bar any where.norton 2008 has this as well.not a big deal if one reads before clicking away.

[Thug21]

IMO, one shouldn't have to worry about "reading before clicking" with paid security software, though. :)
It's simply not a welcome trend to me.

[rdsok]

-{ Quote: "The toolbar is presented as though it is a needed or highly desirable option. It is not properly disclosed that it is a Yahoo search bar and that part of its purpose is to generate additional profits for the vendor. Without proper disclosure, the consumer cannot make an informed choice.

Many people will not object to freeware offering a search bar; however, it is another story entirely when one has purchased a product and then they find that a search toolbar has been foisted upon them, without their informed consent, in order that the vendor may reap additional profits.

As a longtime computer consultant, technician, and Microsoft MVP in the area of Consumer Security, I can assure you that the concerns expressed here are most assuredly not "baloney." It is quite possible that you are just failing to grasp the gravity of the situation, or perhaps the concerns expressed may strike a nerve due to your own interests." }-

I'm not going to argue the point about the toolbar being a "desirable option" or not... it's too subjective. We may as well argue over if chocolate, vanilla, or strawberry ice cream was better since everyone is going to have their own opinion on the subject.

I'm also not sure what you mean about having the users having the toolbar foisted upon them... did you also not pay attention to the installation? Did you not see the following that was presented during installation?...

http://www.rdsok.net/misc/AVG8_Toolbar_installprompt.gif

Obviously that was a rhetorical question... since you must not have paid attention either if you are going to imply that it was foisted upon the users in some way. Its obviously a question that is asked during the installation. Perhaps you are just apposed to it also including a search bar? Or are you simply against a search bar that currently only has Yahoo as its only option at this time? Would it even matter if it were say... a Google search instead? Or are you ( and the others here that are apposed to this ) just prejudiced against all search bars?

If it matters, I would prefer Google if I were asked about it... but I don't think that is the point.

The subject that I was addressing was the number of posts that were trying to imply that having the toolbar was somehow like spyware... which it isn't. I also said trying to imply that it was somehow like spyware was "baloney", not that the users opinion of search toolbars was, so do not twist my words. Installing it is an option that is plainly given to the users during installation. These users were simply trying to make illogical correlations with spyware where none actually existed simply trying to add weight to their argument of disliking having a toolbar added. Of course if they actually had paid any attention to the installation, they would have seen the option plainly given to them to install it or not.

There is no gravity of the situation here... either the user pays attention and actually takes the time to read the prompts presented to them during the installation or they don't. There is no conspiracy as so many are trying to imply. There is an AVG toolbar added ( if the option is taken ) which also happens to have a search feature in it that at this time only has Yahoo as its only option, it is nothing more.. it is nothing less.

So far the implications that so many are complaining about ( it being spyware-like ) are not grounded in any facts... they are only accusations without substance. These posts that try to imply this is somehow like spyware are bogus... they are too much like the witch hunts that took place in Salem, Mass in the USA and have as much credence as those trials... they have no basis in fact as far as what has been presented to this point.

I don't have a problem with a user stating what their opinion is on this or any subject... What I do have a problem with is when they also try to imply that there is something sinister about it without having anything to back their statements on.

[NonSuch]

Your inattention to detail is either woefully inadequate or it's deliberate. Perhaps that may explain why you did not notice, or chose not to notice, the content of the image to which you linked. It clearly states that the toolbar is a "security toolbar." At no point is it mentioned that the toolbar is also a Yahoo search bar and/or that it is being used to generate additional income for Grisoft.

The fact that you only have two posts here at Wilders, both of which are in vigorous defense of AVG's toolbar, does cause me to ponder your motives, especially since you link to AVG from your own site:

http://www.rdsok.net/

[Thug21]

-{ Quote: " At no point is it mentioned that the toolbar is also a Yahoo search bar and/or that it is being used to generate additional income for Grisoft.
" }-

That is exactly my point of contention with this "security bar"

[djohn]

ouch :ouch:

[rdsok]

-{ Quote: "The fact that you only have two posts here at Wilders, both of which are in vigorous defense of AVG's toolbar, does cause me to ponder your motives, especially since you link to AVG from your own site:

http://www.rdsok.net/" }-

Insinuate what you wish... too bad you don't have anything to base them on. They are as baseless as your other comments have been and are simply a matter of your opinion as well.

I normally don't need to visit this forum... but just for your info I was a member previous to its move to Wilders... what that means or proves is nothing as is my having not posted here since means nothing.

[Smokey]

-{ Quote: "Insinuate what you wish... too bad you don't have anything to base them on. They are as baseless as your other comments have been and are simply a matter of your opinion as well.

I normally don't need to visit this forum... but just for your info I was a member previous to its move to Wilders... what that means or proves is nothing as is my having not posted here since means nothing." }-
Hi Randy,

IMO all arguments of NonSuch are valid: you are moderator of AVG Free Forum, anyway, i base on that fact your defense of AVG's toolbar.

Regards,

[rdsok]

-{ Quote: "Hi Randy,

IMO all arguments of NonSuch are valid: you are moderator of AVG Free Forum, anyway, i base on that fact your defense of AVG's toolbar.
Regards," }-

While I'm a mod on the forum... and do like AVG products... I do not work for AVG Technology... I volunteered my time there to help other AVG Free users and that is all.

NonSuch may have valid opinions... but that is all they are ... yet he/she and others keeps trying to use them as facts which they are not. They even stooped so low as to insinuate that somehow even I had something to gain by pointing out the info I brought up... talk about trying to misdirect the topic to avoid the facts...

Again I must point out that what I was bringing up was the constant insinuation that having a search tool on the toolbar was spyware-like and that simply is not the case. In fact I actually use one ( Google ) personally to do research on the malware that I may have not seen before... so the user that mentioned that a search tool isn't useful in fighting malware didn't even consider the researching direction that it could be used for.

[Smokey]

-{ Quote: "While I'm a mod on the forum... and do like AVG products... I do not work for AVG Technology... I volunteered my time there to help other AVG Free users and that is all." }-
Nothing wrong with that, helping the user is always commendable.
-{ Quote: "NonSuch may have valid opinions... but that is all they are ... yet he/she and others keeps trying to use them as facts which they are not. They even stooped so low as to insinuate that somehow even I had something to gain by pointing out the info I brought up... talk about trying to misdirect the topic to avoid the facts..." }-
Fact is too that AVGs toolbar "move" have caused lot of discussion within the security community, and raised many questions by well-respected institutions, malware fighters and site owners. All matured opinions, and most of the time with negative content.
-{ Quote: "Again I must point out that what I was bringing up was the constant insinuation that having a search tool on the toolbar was spyware-like and that simply is not the case. In fact I actually use one ( Google ) personally to do research on the malware that I may have not seen before... so the user that mentioned that a search tool isn't useful in fighting malware didn't even consider the researching direction that it could be used for." }-
I have no doubts about your good intentions with AVG. But isn't it wiser staying out of the whole discussion about the subject, anyway on other boards then the AVG forum? E.g. by participating this "Wilders thread" you don't serve Grisofts interests, by your way of defending the toolbar issue you provoke the AVG toolbar opposition.

Regards,