Index.Dat File

[zarzenz]

I am currently in the process of trying various programs ...window washer ...internet sweeper ...spider etc. to find out the easiest way of deleting the index.dat file.

However, one thing is starting to puzzle me. I keep reading that the index.dat file should be found in the cookies, temp int files and history folders. But even with my system set to show hidden files, I only see it in the cookies folder.

Is this correct or should I also see it in the other folders.

[controler]

I am using Windows XP at present and I have my set to display contents of system folders AND show hidden files and folders.
Then doing a search of my computer using more advanced options
and having search system folders, search hidden files and folders
and search sub folders, I get 25 references to Index.Dat found in various places.
I have sent a few to
www.****microsoft.com

remove the spaces from the four letter word.

edit Forum Admin: link altered. please don't circumvent - seems obvious enough ;)

[javacool]

The index.dat file is conveniently hidden on many versions of windows, even when you have hidden files set to be shown.

Below I have written about two methods you may use to discover this file - the second method is more useful, in my case, but you may find the first method easier to perform.

[hr]

You can, however, locate these files if you know the DIRECT path to them.

Example for History folder: C:\....\History\History.IE5\index.dat

Browse to that location in Windows Explorer, and you will get a box asking if you want to open or save that file.

The Temporary Internet Files index.dat file can also be found under:
(ex.) C:\....\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\index.dat

[hr]

NOTE: The following method is only recommended if you know what you are doing.

TWEAK:

There is an even easier method to making the directory structure of your Temporary Internet Files folder visible (and, thus, you will now be able to see the index.dat file too!)

1.) Browse to your temporary internet files folder.
2.) Look at the path in Windows explorer...add a "\desktop.ini" to the path name to open a special hidden file.1
3.) Make sure to open this file in Notepad.
4.) Save a backup copy to a folder on your desktop (or anywhere else for that matter) but make sure to change the ending to .txt.
5.) Close Notepad, and follow the steps above to open the file again.
6.) Now, delete the line that says the following:
{QUOTE-> UICLSID={7BD29E00-76C1-11CF-9DD0-00A0C9034933} <-QUOTE}
It may be slightly different, but there should be only one UICLSID.
7.) Save the file and close all Windows Explorer windows.
8.) Browse to your Temporary Internet Files folder again, and voila! You now can see your index.dat file, and all the weird folders that Internet Explorer actually stores file in.

You can follow the same method for your History folder, but instead delete the line that looks like this:
{QUOTE-> CLSID={FF393560-C2A7-11CF-BFF4-444553540000} <-QUOTE}

WARNING: Using this method for the History folder will remove its functionality from within Internet Explorer. (You will see all of the folders, etc.) Saving a backup of the desktop.ini file is HIGHLY recommended. (Remember to rename the extension)

[hr]

Hope this helps!

-javacool

[hr]

Footnotes:
1The desktop.ini file is used in many "customized" folders in Windows to change their appearance, functionality, etc. It is hidden by default, and the only way to access it is to use a direct path.

[zarzenz]

Thanks guys for that. I should have added I'm using WinME. This clears the situation for me. Now I know that what I see is ok and its just a case of these files being 'extra hidden' within the windows system.

The info to find them may well prove to be very useful but for now I will just continue to try out these cleanup programs in the knowledge that all is as it should be.

Btw...I've just found this program called PurgeIE that looks very good for clearing all the tracks away.

http://aandrc.com/purgeie/

Its got a nice feel to it and a very good help section which is most useful whilst I am on this learning curve.

[helpin]

Just as long as you remember that IEPurge doesn't really purge anything. It deletes it, no different from hitting the delete key. There is no filewiping at all in the program.

[zarzenz]

Hi helpin,

Well... you have now raised a very important point. When you say just delete am I correct in thinking that this just removes the file from being 'visible' whilst looking at these various folders, and this means that they could still be viewed with the right drive recovery software. Just like any deleted file is still intact on the drive but simply marked as available for overwriting. And when you say wiped... is this what is meant by bleaching and in this case the actual file is immeadiately overwritten with random data after deletion.

To be honest... my main requirement is simple deletion at the moment whilst I learn more about this subject but I think its important to have a full understanding of whats involved here and for that I thank you for bringing this to my attention.

BTW... I really like PurgeIE... and it is very effective at deleting those pesky index.dat files with its little batch program running in DOS at startup in emergency mode, very nice and so easy to get used to. Also getting to like Internet Sweeper more as I play with it but wont say anymore about that here as its got its own board for posts about it. So still evaluating but got a better idea of what I want now.

[cshell]

Dumb question I know. What is the security risk with
index.dat file? After reading the post I looked at it
in the cookies folder. It seems to me to be a general
index of the few cookies, I allow to remain on my PC.

[zarzenz]

Hi cshell,

I'm new to all this but if I've understood it correctly then there are three index.dat files. The other two are 'extra hidden' in history and temp int files and are capable of holding all the details of sites visited long after you delete the files they are referenced to. If you install the Spider program from here

http://www.fsm.nl/ward/spider116.zip

then it can scan your index.dat files and even clean them.

However because it seems to fail to clean WinME systems after the first sucessful run...I'm now trying out some other programs that can do the same thing.

Hope I've got this right...maybe some more experienced members could explain in more detail if I've got this wrong.

[controler]

Well just make sure whatever program you are using cleans the Temporary internet Folder\Content.IE folders also or do it manualy
Trying to see if Patrick can do it in SpyBot in the future...
All your pictures , urls ect stored there too.....
in the Content.IE Alphanumeric subfolders.

[cshell]

Thanks,

They certainly are 'extra hidden' . I use Windows ME
too, and they did not show up after checking the option
to show hidden files.

[javacool]

{QUOTE-> quoting: cshell link=board=22;threadid=1994;start=0#15016 date=1025381157]
Thanks,

They certainly are 'extra hidden' . I use Windows ME
too, and they did not show up after checking the option
to show hidden files.
<-QUOTE}

In versions of Windows (98 and up, I believe) certain properties can makes this file, and the underlying directory structure hidden. When you open the Temporary Internet Files folder, you see a long list of files (images, web pages, etc) but the files aren't actually located there. (See my post above for more.)

-javacool

[controler]

Javacool?

I don't think we are on the same page here LOL

Believe me the files are there and NOT just shortcuts...

IN Win XP it is under C:\Documents and settings\Local Settings\Temporory Internet Files\Content.IE\C12NOXIR ect... 4 folders

In Windows ME it is C:\Windows\Tempory Internet Files\Content.IE\Bla Bla Bla

[javacool]

{QUOTE-> quoting: controler link=board=22;threadid=1994;start=0#15074 date=1025409448]
Javacool?

I don't think we are on the same page here LOL

Believe me the files are there and NOT just shortcuts...

IN Win XP it is under C:\Documents and settings\Local Settings\Temporory Internet Files\Content.IE\C12NOXIR ect... 4 folders

In Windows ME it is C:\Windows\Tempory Internet Files\Content.IE\Bla Bla Bla
<-QUOTE}

I'm sorry, I should have specified more clearly.

What I was aiming for was the files are not actually located under
C:\Documents and Settings\...\[bTemporary Internet Files[/b] (with nothing following it)
BUT the hidden subdirectory structure under that.

I'm sorry for any confusion I may have caused.

-javacool

[cshell]

I want to thank each one who has replied to my request in any way.
zarzenz, javacool, controler.

I want you to know I appreciate your attempt to help me understand
a little more of this tech stuff.

I went to Temp Internet files\IE. The index.dat files do not show up.
I did not check the History folder. My opinion is that if one is not
showing up the other one won't either.

PS: This is after checking show hidden files on explorer.

I use Windows ME. Maybe this will help. When applying the show hidden
folders, or when clearing that option my screen does some weird things.
The first time I did this the PC froze. I had to kill the power to the
PC. The last few times I have applied or cleared this check box the
screen only did funny things. No freeze up.

I'm still not sure why the files are a security risk. In my opinion
no one has addressed this question. Are they phoning home? Are
they a risk because an unauthorized user of my PC might open them?
Or are they a risk due to a hacker. I really would like some more input
on this. I do realize that these files containg info. I do not understand
why they are a security risk.

If the Risk is due to a hacker, then I would like to know this. I have a
lot of credit card info on my PC. I try to keep it at a minimum, but
some times it can't be avoided. Some Internet shoppers will not order
on-line. They call. Eventually I have to type their CC number.

Trying to protect other peoples info is why I'm interested in this topic.
Also, I'm concerned that there are files that MS have hidden so deeply that
I can't access them.

[FanJ]

Quote from the Helpfile of IEClean with respect to the option in IEClean: "Show all file extensions":

[hr]

Microsoft LOVES to maintain "hidden" and "super-hidden" files in order to hide MANY of the "inner workings of Windows" ... So MUCH of Windows is completely hidden that viruses, trojan horse remote back doors and other nasties can easily hide from view since you are left unable to determine what the TRUE filename of an email file attachment REALLY is, and when you go to look for files in Windows file explorer, you are not shown what the files REALLY are.

This function is HIGHLY recommended to be enabled. It will show you the TRUE file extension of any unknown files so that you can determine if they really ARE a media or innocuous filename or if they are a VBS, EXE, PIF, SCR or other executable file and not what they CLAIM to be. This capability alone will show you if a file REALLY IS "mypicture.JPG" or "mypicture.JPG.EXE" which would be a sure sign of a virus or other nasty when you go to download it. IF you let IEClean unhide file extensions, you will see a LOT more files that you never knew existed before, and you will be able to spot suspicious files by the double file extensions which you'll now see and the unexpected ".exe" AFTER the ".MPG" the file CLAIMED to be.

In addition, selecting this option will reveal a NUMBER of folders and files you never knew were ALREADY on your machine. We cannot emphasize ENOUGH how useful this is in protecting your privacy, and even more importantly your security. However, you will need to get used to seeing longer filenames in all of your displays and furthermore, new folders that had always been sneaked past you that were always part of windows. Checking this option will cause Windows to UNHIDE many files and folders you never saw before and serves to warn you if a file you download is NOT what it appeared to be. The HIDING of "file extensions" is the most grievous security danger IN windows. This option will defeat Microsoft's attempts to hide all nasties.

IEClean is Copyright 1996-2001 by Privacy Software Corporation
[hr]
website:
www.nsclean.com

[FanJ]

Quote from the Helpfile of IEClean:

[hr]

"XML persistence," otherwise known as "UserData persistence" or "supercookies" were introduced in Internet Explorer 5.0 but didn't work very well. In IE 5.5, this latest privacy risk has not only become functional but threatens to become a very serious privacy risk in the future as more and more sites find this to be an excellent alternative to cookies as far as the magnitude of data that can be stored and the detail of that data.

"UserData" is designed to allow sites to leave data on your machine which they can then access without any warnings at all. This is something completely different from "cookies." There are no limits on the size of UserData while cookies are generally limited to 2000 bytes or so in size. Microsoft envisions large amounts of data being stored in these areas which is why the hidden structure and location of UserData is built to be as large as the caches (temporary internet files) with four subfolders and an INDEX.DAT file all its own. As of this writing, UserData is just starting to be used and right now, not all that many people have any resident on their system. This will change very quickly now that UserData is now functioning in IE 5.5.

Selecting this item instructs IEClean to destroy all accumulated UserData in the same manner that IEClean rids you of other intrusions. It will clean out the contents of all subfolders as well as the INDEX.DAT database. Since we see UserData becoming a major future problem, we've also made UserData cleanups an option in the "traybar icon" as well. If you'd like to know more about UserData, do a search on the internet using the word "UserData" as the search parameter. One of the results will be Microsoft's MSDN site. Go have a look.

IEClean is Copyright 1996-2001 by Privacy Software Corporation
[hr]
website:
www.nsclean.com

[FanJ]

And see also threads at an older board:

http://pub24.ezboard.com/fsecureyesecurityfrm6.showMessage?topicID=169.topic

http://pub24.ezboard.com/fsecureyesecurityfrm6.showMessage?topicID=157.topic

[controler]

This has turned out to be a good discussion.
About a year or so ago. I found some registry tweaks in Windows ME to show even more. I forwarded them on to the riddler at

Http://www.F---microsoft.com

Oops posted that link again LOL
I just wish I could remember what they were again now
I had to dig deep to find them and then it was only a matter of changing the value from 1 to 0 or viseversa
WHich is really the only thing you do when telling WIndows to show
file extentions, System folders and files and hidden files.

[zarzenz]

Guys... this is just the sort of stuff I'm looking for... thanks.

You raised a good point cshell about what exactly are the implications of all this. Well for me its just the fact that I object to 'stuff' being put on my system in the form of extra hidden files. I know MS will probably say that its all to make web sites load faster if the cache has previous files in there, but when these files are deleted then there is no good reason for the index.dat file to retain them.

Thats when I see my privacy as comprimised. Files still holding details of previous sites that I thought I'd got rid of. And to me its just the same regardless of the innocence or whatever of the particular site... I just object to this practice.

But it could also be a serious issue for some people if lets say family members use the same computer for browsing and someone has a piece of software on a floppy that they can use to scan the index data... wow... all sorts of problems there to start with.

Then what about hackers you ask... yeah... I'm sure if someone got into your system then all this data could be accessed. But that would apply to all areas of you documents in the same way and if you hold credit card details then you would have to take steps to stop this by always using a good firewall etc. But thats another topic altogether and there are loads of guys who could point you in the right direction on that one.

[cshell]

zarzenz,

I use ZA Pro for a fire wall. No one but me has physical access to my PC.
So the files are probably not a threat to me. However, if I ever have to have the PC worked on ( Such as sending it to a repair Center ) then those files could be a problem because the repairmen could conceivably extract sensitive info from them.

What is bugging me at this point is that I can't find them. Checking the show hidden files option, and going to the exact folder locations still does not reveal them. There are 4 catch files under the Temp folder. They also seem to be empty. I am wandering now what might be in them that I can't see.

[FanJ]

See also this long thread at DSLR Security Forum:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3683270~root=security,1~mode=flat

[spy1]

It is an irritating little problem, isn't it?

cshell - You may want to go ahead and try the Spider116 route to start with. http://www.winplanet.com/winplanet/reviews/741/2/ .
(Good info there, BTW, you might want to read all of it). Basically, just run the program and see what it finds, and let us know. I just ran it a few minutes ago, and it reduced the size of the index.dat from 'Size: 48 KB/Size on Disc: 64KB' both to 32 KB.

I'm not really clear on what you are (or are not) seeing.

Can you see the index.dat file at all, anywhere?

If not, have you done a wildcard search? ( *index.dat ) using Start/Search/For Files or Folders/Search for Files or Folders Named: *index.dat 'Look in Local Hard Drives (C:;D:)'?

Interesting note: When I did that Search, above, there were an awful lot of 'index.dat's that came up - but the majority of them were jv16 back-ups! I 'Erased' them. Pete

[zarzenz]

cshell... I dont know where the credit card info would be held on your system... I would imagine you probably use a particular program that allows such data to be entered to enable whatever your needs are to be done. I have no knowledge of this sort of thing myself.

However, if you want to have a look at what data is currently being held in the 3 index.dat files then download Spider from here

Deleted... see edit at bottom of post.

You can then scan the files to see whats in them... be prepared for an eye opener experience when you do... and then you can run the clean up tool or if you prefer you can exit the program at that point without altering anything on your system. This will allow you 'thinking time' to enable you to decide the best course of action. This is the point in time that I have now passed having tried a few of the programs out there that will automate the clean up process. I only use Spider now to act as my scan tool and am now deciding on which of the clean up programs suit my requirements best.

Hope this helps... your needs may well be different to mine but it amazed me when I saw what the index.dat files contained.

Pete... I must have been writing the above as you posted your reply... so didn't mean to double up what you said about Spider. I've deleted my link as yours is better... cheers.

[spy1]

cshell - On the first page from the link Jan gave, I copied this reg fix link from M.Jannson's site: http://www.markusjansson.net/eng.exe.sig ( direct d/l link ). From Marcus's site: "Index.dat files contain information about websites you have visited, things you have done, cookies you have received, etc. The main purpose, according to Microsoft, is that they speedup browsing by keeping this information nearby. The problem is, that they don’t delete when you clear your temporary internet files! This is because Windows locks those files. They need to be cleared BEFORE it has a chance of doing that. So here's my recipe for it. Please note that this will also delete all your browsing history, since it deletes the content of “history”, “cookies” and “temporary internet files” folders. All of those index.dat files and folders this deletes will be re-created by Windows during the bootup.

Windows95/98/ ME(English language version) all you need to do is to download and run eng.exe (here is my PGP signature for it), it will guide to the rest. . To remove this tweak, delete xxx.bat and xxx.pif files from C:\ and delete registry value (use regedit) from [KEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Run] "xxx.bat" ".

So, if you're not happy with the results you get from Spider 1.16, you might want to try that, too. Pete

Note: After applying the regfix here, the 'Size' of the index.dat (as shown in 'Properties' ) immediately reduced to 16KB - that's as small as you're ever going to see it get.

[cshell]

I want to thank everyone who has posted in this thread, and in particular
to my questions. You all are a patient and helpful group. Doing the wild
card search, *index.dat only 2 index.dat files were shown. 1 was in the
cookies folder, the other was C\Windows\Applications. After downloading and
scanning with Spider 116 a few more were revealed.

C:\WINDOWS\Application Data\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\UserData\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\Cookies\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\History\History.IE5\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\History\History.IE5\MSHist012002070120020702\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\History\History.IE5\MSHist012002070220020703\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\History\History.IE5\MSHist012002062420020701\index.dat
C:\WINDOWS\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\index.dat

It will take a while for me to absorb all the helpful information you all
have provided, but you have put me on the right track, and because I am
a little slow at this tech stuff I will get it figured out because of the
information you all have provided.

Thanks.

[zarzenz]

Guys,

I seem to have got a combination of programs running that is keeping the cookies I need and killing the others and at the same time removing all strays in the index.dat file.

I'm now using CookieWall
http://www.analogx.com/contents/download/network/cookie.htm

and CacheSentry
(cant get link to work... try google)

Starting with a completely clean 16kb index.dat file, I then loaded up both programs and then started visiting my good sites to get the required cookies. Then I set up CookieWall to delete all others as they appear and then I found that CacheSentry seems to clean all the strays out on the next boot up so I'll test out this combination over the next few days to see how it goes.

[helpin']

I'm confused about this thread. Are there people just trying to figure out how to clean the index.dat file? That is easily done by Window Washer or Tracks Eraser Pro. I like TRP better (ONLY "pro" though. The cheaper version doesn't wipe), though Window Washer is a good program. They also both let you keep "good" cookies and wipe the others. I am just not sure what the issue of this thread is. There's nothing to cleaning index.dat but running one of those or countless other programs. Am I missing something?

Tracks Eraser Pro: http://www.acesoft.net/
Window Washer: http://www.webroot.com/washer.htm
Both of these programs also have plug-ins for hundreds of programs and TRP has a very simple plug-in maker.
Free 30 day trials for both.

Seems there's a lot of time being spent on something that can be done so easily. I must be missing something. If I am and it's passed right over my dull brain, fill me in.

[zarzenz]

Hello helpin,

Ok... you are absolutely right in everything you say and I can see how you are confused so I will now try and explain better what I'm doing here.

First of all... this index.dat problem has been developing with me as I get into this subject more and by that I mean at the start of all this I didn't even know what these 3 files were doing (or that the 2 hidden ones even existed).

So when I first started looking at cleaner programs that said they could deal with the cookies/cache/history I was pleased until I then discovered (mainly by using the spider program) that this index.dat file kept a reference all of its own which was a difficult thing to clean without the correct program or DOS batch file running... simply deleting the contents of the unhidden cookies one was not the answer.

So then I got to know about programs like window washer and purgeie etc which all worked well except for one big problem... they are all shareware.

Ok... now you see where I'm coming from.

I am a bit of a freeware type person. I dont like paying for programs if I can find a freeware version that does everything I need. Otherwise it would take all the fun out of trying 'new stuff' as I cant afford to do that all the time.

In fact... I'll be honest... I liked purgeie so much that I was just about to register it after its 15 day ran out when I found the above combination working.

I must now stress the importance to me of not just deleting the index... heck thats the easy bit, but it will leave stray cookies that are not actually seen in the cookies folder that are still referenced in the index. If you open the index.dat with notepad and scroll down the list you can see them as plain as day and this was my task... to be able to save the cookies I want (only about 5 or 6) and kill all the others and yet not produce any stray references anywhere that could be viewed.

By the way this is because I'm a bit of a clean up nut. I just dont like anything hanging around on my computer if I dont use it... thats all.

So hope this sorts out whats going on here. The ability to keep everything as I want it but without paying if I can do it for free. I dont think I can be more honest than that and if freeware stuff is made available then I think it should be used to the full and enjoyed as the authors of the programs intended.

[MyNethingyman]

Only if you are running Win98.


Consider using Mr Bears delete on your system as a tool. Once installed, you can clean out index.dat and other files on demand.

You can download it from here and it is free.
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,1870282~root=security,1~mode=flat
(http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,1870282~root=security,1~mode=flat)



There are other free ones available on the Internet..but make sure they will work with your OS.


This one is a simple batch file with a GUI.

[zarzenz]

MyNethingyman... thanks for that link... I'll take a close look at it later and run through some of the forum posts there... all info on this subject I'm currently soaking up like a sponge. Only problem for me on that one is I'm running WinME so probably wont be suitable but still worth looking at for reference etc... cheers.

[spy1]

There's also a special version of BearsDelete for WME. Pete

[Yeovil]

Here are two good little (FREE) programs that I use.....

Spider.....http://www.fsm.nl/ward/

Spider will show you what is contained in your hidden index.dat file, and give you the option to delete it.


Xen.....http://homepage.ntlworld.com/mrx9000/

Xen will also delete the hidden index.dat file with one of it's cleanup options, plus has other options to do a WHOLE lot more cleaning on your system.
It does not list the contents of the index.dat file for viewing though.

[spy1]

Yeovil - Welcome to the forum!

Yes, a lot of us here have experience with both Spider and Xen (BTW, please use caution with some of the options available in Xen - you can wipe out stuff you might really need with a single click if you get too happy while using it! ;D ). Pete

[Nancy_McAleavey]

Here's the newsletter I recently published on this. There are some serious problems in using batch files to delete these items, due to their inherent recoverability:

Perhaps it's a result of the times. I've been seeing a growing interest once again around the security forums and newsgroups in Internet Explorer's index.dat file, its contents and how to go about cleaning it out. Many are recommending setting up batch files to delete cookies, history recent files and other temporary internet files at bootup. As it was in the days of the MM256 and MM2048 databases, index.dat is locked once Windows is up.

There's a problem with doing this that just about everyone seems to be missing. Deleting files with DOS commands are just as recoverable as those deleted through the Recycle Bin. We know that files in Recycle Bin are readily accessible until the bin is emptied, and recoverable afterward, but most of us miss the "Undelete" command in the "C:\Windows\Command" folder. Deletions in DOS are recoverable, and it's possible for a trojan with "Command Line Access" to invoke this call, restore those deleted files, and recover your internet tracks. It's easy for your employer and probably some of your family members on your home network , for instance, to do the same.

These batch files don't catch many of the other files associated with index.dat and the IE browser that show up in other locations (and are also hidden from ready access through the OS). Fishing these out can get very tedious, time consuming and can require getting around in the system registry, where many users fear to go (wisely) given the risk of potential harm to their system. Auto-restore features in the newer Windows versions can end up restoring everything if the user doesn't know how to go about completely disabling it first.

If you're among those with a rising concern about others finding out what's on your system, you need to consider how you wish to go about securing your deletions, which is done by overwriting the disk space formerly occupied by those files, above and beyond the deletion of the file header done by Windows (and MS- DOS). Our IEClean makes it all much easier as it gets around the operating system file locks to clean and overwrites the specific files, along with the "orphan" file segments stored elsewhere in hidden locations on your system, and completely disables the Auto-restore feature in Windows to ensure the files can't come back. Our FileVac (included with IEClean and available as a standalone) handles whole-disk overwrites of unused disk space and secure individual file deletions from the desktop, providing the protection of secured deletion for the whole system.

From a user: IEClean works great on spyware, wiping it out after every session. No need to have additional monitoring programs running while you surf. Keep your privacy AND speed up your system and connection by losing that monitoring software. Every program that runs uses system resources and slows your connection if it's sniffing packets. No need for it with IEClean!

[Paul Wilders]

Hi Nancy,

I'm with you here in regard to your theory concerning the index.dat files - thanks for the contribution!

regards.

paul

[zarzenz]

Hi Nancy,

IEClean was recommended to me to try a while back, but... it only appears to be available on purchase from the very start... no trial period... why is this?

My problem with this type of software is I'm really fed up now with some programs claiming to be able to completly delete or wipe the index.dat file and then when a test with spider is preformed after the said clean is done... lo and behold... the files are still sitting there as plain as day for all to see. This is not good.

So yeah... whilst I would love to try IEClean as it does look very well thought out from the screenshots, I don't want to have to pay for it and then find it also gives me the same poor result as some of the others.

So why not make it available as a 5 day trial. After all, it would only need a couple of tests to see if it did the full job and then it could be purchased. If it's as good as it looks and from what you said above then it would sell easy I'm sure and in fact you may sell more if the trial option was there because there must be loads of people like me who want to try it but don't want the hassle of getting money back if it doesn't... I don't like that idea... too much risk involved with using credit cards and then finding you got to go back for refunds etc... trialware is much better.

So Nancy... any chance of doing that and letting us give IEClean a good workout for a few days and then we can all see how good it really is and dump all the other rubbish programs where they belong... in the trash can.

[FanJ]

Hi Zarzenz,

With respect to the money-back policy of PSC, a little story:
From my own experience (as I posted in another thread months ago) I can tell you that it really works perfectly:
once, after buying the upgrade from IEClean 5.5 to version 6.0, I seemed to have problems with it; I overreacted and asked Nancy my money back; within a few hours it was confirmed both by her and by DigitalRiver that I would get my money back; and yes, indeed, I did get my money back; then I realised that it was just my own fault and that I didn't want to use my machine without IEClean; so, I bought the upgrade once again; happy end of the story! :)

[zarzenz]

Hi FanJ,

Yep... it was your recommendation a while back that I was referring to above and I have seen other posts of yours where you have mentioned it and so I really would like to try it.

Now don't get me wrong here as I am in no way saying that I don't trust what you or Nancy have claimed about this program... quite the reverse in fact... I can't wait to try it and see for myself how good it is based on your comments... there is no better way to get good programs other than recommendation from satisfied users.

And fair enough... if the money back thing is that good then maybe, just maybe, I'll give that route a try.

But my point was and still is... why not make IEClean available as a very short trial period and written in such a way that would make reinstallation impossible like other similar programs do... PurgeIE being one example.

That way the user could test it out over a few days and then when the days expire... it would have to be purchased to be re-activated and then everyone would be happy and if by some chance some little part of the program did not function as the user anticipated... then no problem... it could be uninstalled and forgotten about.

Anyway thanks FanJ for your comments... I'll think it over and may put an order in but I'll wait to see if Nancy would like to respond first... then decide for sure... cheers.

[MyNethingyman]

{QUOTE-> quoting: spy1 link=board=22;threadid=1994;start=30#16640 date=1026559939]
There's also a special version of BearsDelete for WME. Pete
<-QUOTE}

Which reminds me Pete,
I think you will find that the bd.zip offered at the free wilders download is the one for Win98. I think it should be marked there someplace that it is for 98.


The one for ME was called beardelete2.exe.

I have a copy of it. If you guys want it to offer I am sure he will not mind. But Wilders should make a note on the one they offer is for win98. it will save people a lot of headaches ::)
Regards,
John

[FanJ]

Hi Zarzenz,

I'll ask Nancy to have a look, but I think that PSC will not change their policy with respect to trial versions; it has been asked in the past by others too....

Cheers, Jan.

[FanJ]

Hi John,

Thanks! I have send Paul W. an IM about it.

Cheers, Jan.

[zarzenz]

Thanks FanJ,

I'll be away from the board for the next few days.

[Paul Wilders]

zarzenz,

{QUOTE-> But my point was and still is... why not make IEClean available as a very short trial period and written in such a way that would make reinstallation impossible like other similar programs do <-QUOTE}

Nancy will no doubt correct me in cas I'm wrong: PSC has taken this route to avoid software piracy. Goes for all their software as far as I know.

John,

{QUOTE-> The one for ME was called beardelete2.exe. <-QUOTE}

You're absulotely right here..

{QUOTE-> I have a copy of it. If you guys want it to offer I am sure he will not mind. <-QUOTE}

Not sure if we have a copy: obliged if you would send us a copy webmaster@wilders.org

{QUOTE-> But Wilders should make a note on the one they offer is for win98. it will save people a lot of headaches <-QUOTE}

We'll address this on the next update; thanks!

regards.

paul

[MyNethingyman]

Emailed BearDelete2.zip this AM :)

Good luck to all of you on the idex.dat

IEClean works great...but there are many others out there to satisfy everyone's need.

[controler]

A bat file on boot is a very good idea. Isn't it funny we don't want to give up DOS?

You don't need to use the DELETE or DELTREE command. You can run any DOS based EXE file. Wasn't scorch a DOS based file deleter?
1. Delete files for good
2. Delete Sawp file on shutdown


http://www.bonaventura.free-online.co.uk/realdelete/

http://www.stack.nl/~galactus/remailers/index-wipe.html


DOS Commands:

http://www.easydos.com/dosindex.html

A MUST HAVE FREE DOS programs link:

http://members.cox.net/dos/


*Fixed one link. Pete
Thanks Pete :D

[john little]

Hi everyone, Wilders is still the best place on the net to kick this stuff around and discuss. By the way, Checkout, (one of my faves on the board), I am impressed reading how concerned you have become with privacy issues. I don't know if I ever mentioned this, but be sure and make Privacy Digest a daily stop. Updated daily and the latest is always there: http://www.privacydigest.com/.....Oops, I'm hijacking the thread! Sorry. On to business....and this is an important issue.......

I wanted to address zarzenz on this issue of trialware for IEClean. I agree with you, it would be nice. HOWEVER, and this is a big however, Kevin and Nancy McAleavey and PSC made the right decision from the start on this. This is their business - not a hobby. If they made IEClean available in trial versions, it is of such quality that it would take no time at all for it to be available all over the Internet with cracks, serials and warez. They would lose A LOT of money, and they're not big enough to absorb the losses. I would prefer them to continue making money and spending their time researching new software as opposed to spending their time constantly having to issue new releases on their old software to keep a step ahead of the crackers.

As nice as it would be to have trialware for IEClean, the reasons they don't are sound - and I support them 100%.

Best to you,
John Little
"Luv2BSecure"

[spy1]

Hey, stranger! Great to see you posting! Don't hesitate to do MORE of it in the future! Pete

[snowman]

stranger indeed.......good to see you Luv2...been awhile...hope all has been well.......doing good I hope.


snowman

[John Little]

Hey! Thanks for the "hellos"...I read what you all have to say all the time. Pete, hope you're doing okay and snowy, I hope this finds you feeling well. I just felt strongly enough about PCS not using trialware that would keep them busy staying a step ahead of the crackers to post. Thanks for the notes!

John
"luv2BSecure"

[zarzenz]

Hi John Little,

First of all, apologies for my late reply but I've been on vacation in Cornwall, England for the last week and this is the first chance I've had to return to the board.

Anyway... to get back to the subject of the trial offer of IEClean etc.

John... I read your reply... and it was so clear and precise and made so much sense that I want to say I'm sure you are right. I don't know anything about Kevin and Nancy or PSC but you have convinced me that everything you posted there is the right way for them to do business.

Thanks John for that, all the best to you and everyone else who has contributed to this thread which has helped me get to grips with the index.dat problem.