Tiny's Trojan Trap

[Checkout]

I'm just trying out Trojan Trap 3 and I'm wondering what to do with other installed software which already performs some of its functions. *For example, ZAP 3 can handle mobile code (ActiveX/Java) and cookies, but would I be better off leaving those functions to Trojan Trap?

Any thoughts or experiences welcomed. *Thanks.

[Zhen-Xjell]

In my short experience with TTT, it seems if it is configured properly, perhaps nothing else is really needed? *TTT does provide for the possibility of completely sand boxing the system and its apps.

[Checkout]

At the moment, I can't connect to my ISP - the connection is made but no data is being transferred (ie, it won't complete the logon) since I installed TTT.

And, boy, what an install! *I let it run overnight!

[spy1]

Checkout - That doesn't sound good. If you had to let it do an overnight install, something's possibly wrong with the d/l itself, I don't care how slow your computer is.

I think you're going to find that TTT is going to slow you down even with a good d/l/install. Make sure you check out resources and processor usage while trying it. Pete

[Checkout]

I gave the wrong impression. *TTT (optionally) does a full CRC on the C drive files. *Naturally, that takes a while! * :)

[Paul Wilders]

Checkout,

Just curious: did you install McAfee anti-virus as well (included in the latest version as far as I know - personally I've got v1.0 stashed somewhere here).

regards.

paul

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> Checkout,

Just curious: did you install McAfee anti-virus as well (included in the latest version as far as I know - personally I've got v1.0 stashed somewhere here).
<-QUOTE}

No. *I was using AVG but I shut that down first.

[Paul Wilders]

{QUOTE-> No. <-QUOTE}

Good decision * ;)

regards.

paul *

[javacool]

{QUOTE->

Good decision * ;)

regards.

paul * <-QUOTE}

Agreed. *;)

[Checkout]

What I did find - yet again - is that installing new software (at least, security/internet related software) resets from XP dialler from "any user" to "me only" and stops me connecting to my ISP!

Damn MicroSoft!!

Er...any chance of turning off this stupid filter so I can say D_A_M_N when it's appropriate, please?

[UNICRON]

D@MN checkout, filters are nessessary! you should know tha sh!t by now. snicker.

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> D@MN checkout, filters are nessessary! you should know tha sh!t by now. snicker. <-QUOTE}
Previous remark heavily edited for the sake of Anglo-Canadian relationships.

[UNICRON]

I wasn't intending to insult you, I was actually only trying to demonstrate filter beating techniques. Sorry that wasn't obvious.

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> I wasn't intending to insult you, I was actually only trying to demonstrate filter beating techniques. Sorry that wasn't obvious. <-QUOTE}
Just pushing your buttons for that snicker. *No insult taken. * ;D

[crashandburn]

How are you getting on with the TTT? *I've been giving some thought to it myself, ever since my last ISP (Cloud-Nine) was killed by a DDoS, but *to a barely IT-competent individual like myself it seems bewilderingly complex.

For info, I'm running XP with a full suite of Norton 2002 Utilities (inc firewall and AV), plus some other freebies from the net (Ad-Aware, Adshield etc..). *And my system is clean and trojan free at the moment (well thats what a Tauscan said)!

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> How are you getting on with the TTT? <-QUOTE}
I like it. *In fact, I'm going to spend money and license it. *It reminds me very much of IBM's RACF (Resource Access Control Facility) which is without doubt the finest security software in the commercial world. *I like the fact that I can deny IE access to all but a few registry keys and a few directories.

But it is hard work setting up all the permissions.

[crashandburn]

Looks like its going to be an entertaining afternoon for me then.

;)

[crashandburn]

AAAAAAARGHHHHHHHHHH............. I've got no hair left!!!

That is not so much 'hard work' or 'bewilderinglerly complex' as it is sodd*ng impossible - unless you've a very high degree of IT literacy.

I read through the installation instructions, thoroughly, thought I understand them and tried. *Honest, I really tried! *Lost my nerve half way through the installation when I realised I didn't have a clue what I should be gicing access to / restricting etc.. and cancelled the installation. *That did a pretty good job of breaking my PC. >:(

BSOD, win32 corrupt, etc.. I used Roxio Go-Back to roll back to the start of the day. *My system is at least booting OK now, but its still telling me it has recovered from a serious error every time I boot and despite sending the error message back to Bill's company that message won't clear. *(I know I can disable both sending and notification, but I don't think it should be necessary once you've sent the message back).

Checkout, if you've got that software working, you have my admiration! *Personally I won't go near it again. *IMAO, Tiny are irresponsible to release something that complex without either supporting it or pointing out that you need to be highly IT-competent to install / configure it.

[Checkout]

I'm really sorry to hear that you're having so many problems. *First stop: *disable TTT. *Secondly, put it (selectively) into learning mode for each individual application.

I know it's hard to handle - hence the warning I gave - but once you get used to it, there's no finer, more granular, control software you can use.

Don't give up on it! *You're made of sterner stuff!

[crashandburn]

Well, I didn't give up on it. *Redownloaded it (it disappeared into the electronic ether yesterday when I rolled back), gave it another shot and it appears to be fine. *In fact it appears to be fine with everything on my PC, Norton firewall and AV included.

hmmm... *I think I'll follow your suggestion. *Spend some time configuring the individual applications (application groups?) and seeing if I can break it. *Or what it breaks.

Wish me luck!

:)

[Checkout]

Luck to you!

[crashandburn]

It broke a lot.

:-[

[bubs]

For the benefit of anybody who finds this thread and gets worried that TTT is a monster - v3.0 is now out.

Preconfigures MS apps straight out of the box.

For other tweaking, there are many more folk using it now than were when this thread was live. *Give it a try!

[Grummy]

I'm thinking of trying TTT. One question is the site page giving program info mentions that TTT has the McAfee virus built in. I don't *want *Mc AFee. Does anyone know if there is a way not to down load the McAfee engine. I'm very pleased with my current virus program and desire to stay with it. I'd like to try TTT but not if I have to use McAfee. *::)

[Paul Wilders]

{QUOTE-> Does anyone know if there is a way not to down load the McAfee engine. I'm very pleased with my current virus program and desire to stay with it. I'd like to try TTT but not if I have to use McAfee. *::) <-QUOTE}

Grummy,

You'll have the choice to install McAfee. If you don't feel like it - don't.

regards.

paul

[puff-m-d]

Hello all,

I had tried a previous version of TTT several months ago (not long after it first came out). *I want to try the latest version since so many say there have been many improvements. *The only problem is I cannot install it. *The Installation always aborts after detecting a previous version of TTT.

For curiosity's sake, I also tried to install the new version 3 of TPF but get the same results. *I currently run KPF so I did a complete uninstall of KPF and tried again, same results.

I also did a registry clean and searched for any keys left behind from any of the 3 programs but this did not help either.

I have e-mailed Tiny several times over the past weeks but get no response from them.

Hopefully someone here will be able to help me with this problem.

The error message I get is as follows: "An older version or another application based on the same product was detected! Please uninstall first, then reboot and start the installation again."

Obviously I am missing something, but what? *Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Kent

[Checkout]

Perhaps a registry cleaner might help?

[snowman]

* * *PUFF

* * *just yesterday I had problem along the lines of what you are mentioning.....only in my case I could not fully un-install a program........(in your case it appears this is what may have happened when you un-installed the previous versions.....maybe? )

* * *anyway...it took me several hours and countless crashes to finally get the left-overs out......I located in the registry something I had over-looked numerous times...deleted it......plus all folders....did a defrag...an all was gone. * * the only reason I noticed that something had to still be in the registry was because the program was still showing in add\remove. *in the past I have found that unless I delete left-over folders I get those previous setting etc.....

* * * *don't know if this will be of any help....

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * snowman

[puff-m-d]

Hello all,

I have used jv16powertools, system mechanic, superrabbit, and RegClean to clean my registry as I thought this was more than likely the problem.

I also have used RegHance to search for many different keywords in my registry that may have something to do with TTT.

My uninstall previously appeared to go smoothly and it is not in the add/remove anymore as jv16powertools does not pick up any entries for it in my registry.

I am totally at a loss as where to go from here. *I have searched for files and/or folders that may have been left behind but come up with nothing.

I still believe I have a registry problem with some leftover key after the uninstall. *If anyone knows of a better registry cleaner, please let me know. *It may be something that the cleaners I am using are not picking up but another one would.

Again, thanks for the help as all help is very much appreciated.

Regards,
Kent

[puff-m-d]

Hello all,

I do not know if this means anything to anyone but here is another message I get when trying to install TTT:

"Searching for installed applications
Property: OLDDIR, Signature: OldInstDir"

To me this means it sees the old directory where TTT is installed but it is not there.

What am I missing?

Regards,
Kent

[snowman]

* * * Puff

* * * since you seem to have tryed about everything...the only suggestion I can think of......run Regcleaner....an check the un-install menu....to see if there is a listing for ttt...........an re-check for the ttt old folder..".search" ... "folders"... "C drive" * "program files" ...ttt

* * my friend I really feel for you....yesterday I thought the same problem was going to drive me nuts . *if I can think of anything...anything at all...I'll post.

[spy1]

puff - Looks to me like an email to TTT's tech support is in order from your end.

snowman - It might help to run RegCleaner, but actually (since he's already run jv16PowerTools) he probably won't get any different result from that.

jv16PowerTools and RegCleaner are both by the same guy and do (mostly) the same things the same way. Pete

[linney]

I believe TTT was based on an old program called "Security4u" a lot of the keys in the registry have the old programs ID tag. *Search for "S4U" see if that turns up anything. *Don't delete anything unless your sure it relates to TTT however.

[puff-m-d]

Hello all,

I just sent an e-mail to Tiny Software Support for the third time in as many weeks. *Hopefully I will get an answer or this tells me a lot about their service.

Regards,
Kent

[Checkout]

If I remember correctly, Tiny don't promise any kind of support at all for TTT (something about its "low price").

[puff-m-d]

Checkout,

You are right. *They do not "promise" any support due to the price but it looks like they would at least be interested in trying to sell their product.

I am about to become convinced because of the lack of support that I do not want TTT anyway. *It is a shame because it seems like a good product.

Regards,
Kent

[puff-m-d]

Hello all,

I also e-mailed tiny today concerning installation problems with TPF3. *I have the same problem installing both TTT and TPF3 (guess it is because of the sandbox feature). *Maybe they will be more likely to answer support questions about TPF3. *Thought I would give this route a shot too.

Regards,
Kent

[marti]

Hi Guys,

I decided to try TTT yesterday. *Not sure what I did/didn't do, but had to remove the program in safe mode. *I had just barely started setting it up, when I locked up the computer. *I had to press the reset button, as C + A + D would not work. *I went around and around with trying to boot, that's when I had to remove the app in safe mode.

I'm not sure that I have the time/energy right now to try and get the program properly configured. *It seems that the programmers went out of their way to make TTT very difficult to configure; to make it worse, they came up with a new vocabulary *(no separate glossary in the manual).

TTT does seem to be a great application, for those that have the stamina to set it up. *:D :D :D

marti

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> TTT does seem to be a great application, for those that have the stamina to set it up. *:D :D :D <-QUOTE}
Absolutely. *I'm very impressed with its capability (so much so that I bought it) but it's a long, hard slog to implement it....

[Grummy]

Well after several days of careful study the verdict for myself is : NO WAY. TTT's learning curve is toooo steep for my level of computer knowledge. It works at the very deepest level of the computer--acts as a firewall between your applications and your O/S. One wrong click and you can trash your system big time. *Lots of good material on it at dslreports; after reading several threads like this one-
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3152526~root=kerio~mode=flat~start=0
I realized that I'd be in trouble if I attempted to try it right now. Maybe later. The 100+ page manual and the idea of keeping a note book about each and every app rule, just isn't appealing at this time.
I do believe that if one were to master the program-their system would be 99% Safe. Someday when I get a back up/test computer and /or a second Hard drive I'll go for it. *::)

[Checkout]

{QUOTE-> http://www.dslreports.com/forum....start=0 <-QUOTE}
Grummy, could you check this link please? *It came up dead when I tried it. *Many thanks.

[Grummy]

{QUOTE->
Grummy, could you check this link please? *It came up dead when I tried it. *Many thanks. <-QUOTE}
Sorry -Try:

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3152526~root=kerio~mode=flat~start=0

[Grummy]

Sorry checkout, just getting used to this board as to posting hyperlinks correctly. The dslreport link is fix now .

[Jazzie]

HI All!

Strange that some of you are having problems either installing TTT or getting it to run.
Here is a list of the reg keys and VXD's to manually remove for TPF 3.0/TTT:

Windows 98/ME

Delete all files in the directories "\Program Files\Tiny Personal Firewall" and "\Program
Files\Common Files\PFWShared".
Note! Some dll or exe files are COM modules, so the correct procedure is uninstalling them by "regsvr32
/U some.dll" before deleting.
If you cannot delete some files, please stop TPF Agent Service (Control Panel->
Administration tools->Services)
Delete registry key "HKLM\Software\Tiny Software\Tiny Personal Firewall" (Start ->
regedit.exe) Delete registry key
"HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\VxD\Guard"
"HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\VxD\VNetGrdD" and
"HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\VxD\KrnAgent" and delete files
"Guard.VxD", VNetGrdD.VxD and "KrnAgent.VxD" in "Windows\System" folder.
Note! Changes will occure after a reboot.
Delete umx*.dll and ginst.dll from directory "Windows
\System".

Windows 2000/NT/XP

Delete registry key "HKLM\Software\Tiny Software\Tiny Personal Firewall" (Start ->
regedit.exe)
Delete "umxex.dll" from registry value "AppInit_DLLs" under
"HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Windows".
Note! The file umxex.dll is possible to delete after reboot.
Use the utility "srvinstw.exe" from Windows Resource Kit to uninstall TPF Agent service
and drivers Krnguard, KrnAgent and NetGuard (it is needed to check the option "Include
device drivers").
Note! The reboot is required to take the effect of uninstalation.
Delete umx*.dll and ginst.dll from the directory "Windows\System32".
Remove all remained parts from installation by MSI Cleaner utility (msicu.exe for
Windows 9x/ME, msicuu.exe for NT/2000/XP).

It is very good, once you get it up and running! I know on my side, I had to disable the FW after install for it to reboot into windows(one time only!), if I didn't do that, it would just keep my system in a endless loop of reboots. Had to go into safe mode and rename the guard.vxd (Windows/System) , disable the fw and then re-boot. Enableing the Guard.vxd again and then re-booting and it was fine. So for a rule of thumb, In the future. Is to disable the fw upon installation then after re-boot enable. I have not run into this problem with TTT alone....

CU
Jazzie

[puff-m-d]

Jazzie,

I am one that is having the problem of installing TTT (See thread above). *I hate to sound stupid but I need your help in following your advice above. *The problem is that I understand very little of your instructions and/or am having problems following them.

I did not find the keys you mention on my machine.

The utilities you mention and the Windows Resource Kit is all greek to me. *I can not find this on my system. *Do I need to download it from somewhere? *I guess I need more detailed instruction on this.

I am using Win XP Home.

Thanks in advance,
Kent

[Jazzie]

HI kent

the above instructions are for the TPF 3.0/TTT combo. For TTT the guad.vxd is in your Windows/system directory. Do a search for it. Rename it, then reboot. Then do a recovery install of TTT. Then rename the guard.vxd back. Did you also remove all the kerio keys within the reg cleaner? Just a shot in the dark here... If you keep getting the message that an older product is still installed and has to be removed, then it either still exist in the registry or a directory somewhere!


CU
Jazzie

[puff-m-d]

Jazzie,

I tried your suggestion, but could not find guard.vxd on my system. *I even decided to uninstall Kerio completely and do a thorough registry cleaning afterwards, but this still did not help. *Same old thing trying to install TTT or TPF3.

Like you said, I am sure there is something in my registry making the install process think I have an old version on my system, but I cannot find it. *I have tried six different registry cleaners and done registry searches for every keyword I could think of.

I am just about to the point of giving up. *It has been 9 days since my last e-mail to Tiny (5 or 6 e-mails now in as many weeks). *I have e-mailed them with both TTT and TPF3 as the subject, but still no response, not even an acknowledgment.

Regards and thanks for the help,
Kent

[Jazzie]

Kent, I am sorry to hear that Tiny will not write you back! Even though they state that they don't have customer support because of it's low price, they still should at least answer your e-mails.... :(

How difficult is it for you to format and restore your system from backups?? Or is this out of the question?

CU
Jazzie

[puff-m-d]

Jazzie,

The restore option is as you say "out of the question" as I do not have a backup going back that far (did not think I had a problem *::) until trying to install a new version of TTT). *Besides that , even if I did, I have since changed my system from FAT32 to NTFS and I do not believe a backup of a FAT32 will work for a NTFS system (I may be wrong on this so someone correct me if I am *;D ).

Regards,
Kent

[FanJ]

For those of you who are interested:
a nice thread about TTT at DSLR-Security:
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,3621924~root=security,1~mode=flat