NAV Or PC-cillin?

[Graystoke]

Hi. I'm running NAV 2003 right now but I'm thinking about going with another AV. I've trialed a few, McAfee, e-trust, and PC-cilling. Of those three, I like PCC.

How would you compare PCC to NAV? I'm talking strictly security wise. I'm not concerned about which one uses more resourse. I'm only concerned about protecting my computer. NAV has done a good job, as far as I know there are no nasties on my computer. I don't like the fact that NAV only updates it's virus definitions once a week unless you use the Intelligent Update. To me, that is a hassle. JMHO. All the major AV's update every day. I can't understand why Symantec won't.

Would I be losing/gaining by switching to PCC?

[illukka]

hi
consider trialing a bit more, as there are alot of av's these days. reading this forum you'll find LOTS of threads related to the pros and cons of each av... trial at least nod 32, rav and panda. but usually when you want the best possible protection the unanymous decision is kaspersky antivirus, or products utilizing the KAV engine, like f-secure and avk

[illukka]

but back to your original question ... i would choose nav..

[Ranger]

between nav or pc-cillin ??
Ans: NONE :-X

[Paul Wilders]

Gents,

The original poster would be helped much more in case you would provide reasons as of why state "this one", "that one", "none" ;)

regards.

paul

[JimIT]

I use PCC 2002 on my main box, and like it pretty well.

*It's very easy to use, and the 2003 version has improved it's firewall (though I don't recommend it's use unless it's a pinch) You have the option to not install the firewall when you set up PCC. There is also a website blocker function, which in my view is worthless, so I don't bother with it.

*Interface is much improved, and is very easy to use. Trend is usually one of the first av's to have definitions out for new bugs.

*Updates are, on average, about twice a week, and in 2003, the update feature has been totally automated--ie: set it to get the update, and it will without intervention. They are usually (estimating) around 500k or less. PCC 2002 required you to choose whether to fetch the update immediately, which I personally find a bit annoying.

*Individual files are right-click scannable. My 3.5 gigs of data scans in about 6 minutes. Scans can be scheduled, and always go off without a hitch here.

*Haven't had a virus using PCC, and have used NOD32, GAV, and NAV as backups on a trial basis.

I will probably renew PCC on this box when the license expires, simply because I haven't had a single problem with it--and that's a good thing--although the "curious" side of me wants to try something new. ;D

Regarding NAV: It's a great av. It's not as resource-hungry as it's urban legend would have you believe, however, it IS very invasive upon install, and it's hard to remove completely, although that has been improved also.

The interface is easy, and although some posters complain about it's mail scanning ability, I have never had a problem, and think it's an excellent av also.

Frankly, I regard them both as a tossup. I like PCC's ease of use, though, and will probably stick with it for now, as it's continuing to improve.

HTH

[JimIT]

Here's another...

[Graystoke]

Thanks for your help illukka and JimIT.

Another one of my reasons for thinking of changing AV's is the "unpacking" thing that seems to be the big thing now. I guess NAV is not a very good unpacker. I don't know if I should be so concerned about that or not. But everybody is talking about it and I thought it might be a good thing to have.

illukka, is the avk you mentioned extendia avk pro? That's the only thing I could find with a google search. No trial version offered at their site.

[Karl_Menshy]

Yes, AVK is the extendia package.

But AVK is only a relabeled product, the original version is "AntiVirenKit" by the German company G DATA Software. And they have an english trial on their antiviruslab.com server. The link is:

http://www.antiviruslab.com/e_download.php?lang=gb

Regards,

Karl

[vrf]

NAV is the most used antivirus in the world. Virus writers know that so in many cases they test their viruses with NAV. That's why I think NAV is not such a good choice.And besides, PcCillin has a better trojan detection.

[Graystoke]

I think I'm going to go with PC-cillin. I liked what I saw in the trial version. I like that it does daily virus updates. And I like what vrf said about it detecting more trojans than NAV.

Also I found that I can purchase it at buy.com for $29.99 less a $25.00 rebate. That's seems too good to pass up. :)

I tried downloading the trial version of AVK from the link provided here, but it was in German. Didn't understand a word. :-\

[Graystoke]

Hate to bug you guys again, but I have one more question. How does PC-cillin rate as far as unpacking? Is unpacking something I should seriously take into concideration?

[Firefighter]

To Hobnob from Firefighter!

You can look at the unpacking skills from here!

http://www.rokop-security.de/main/article.php?sid=494

I think there are plenty of better alternatives in there! ;D

By the way, totally free Avast 4 Home has the result in the Rokop test 11 unpackers, when that Avast 3 version in that test has only 10! :D


"The truth is out there, but it hurts!"

Best Regards,
Firefighter!

[_anvil]

Unpacking is most important with regards to trojan/backdoor detection.

If you want _one_ AV programm, which can cope with all kinds of malware (including trojans), it should have good unpacking capabilities. But if you consider using a dedicated anti-trojan app with good memory scan, you can live with a non-unpacking AV.

PC-Cillin has almost no unpack capabilities... comparable to NAV... ::)

Imho, AVK (or extendia or whatever) would be a better choice...

[Graystoke]

Wow! I'm going to hold off on purchasing PC-cillin for now. I need to do some more thinking on this and check out some more AVs. Decisions, decisions. ???

[JimIT]

{QUOTE-> quoting: _anvil link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=0#msg70025 date=1056753446]
Unpacking is most important with regards to trojan/backdoor detection.

If you want _one_ AV programm, which can cope with all kinds of malware (including trojans), it should have good unpacking capabilities. But if you consider using a dedicated anti-trojan app with good memory scan, you can live with a non-unpacking AV.
<-QUOTE}

I agree with anvil here. I use a dedicated anti-trojan, and if you download like a madman, a good AT would be something to consider alongside PCC. If you're on broadband, I'd definitely have a good AT in there.

{QUOTE->
PC-Cillin has almost no unpack capabilities... comparable to NAV... ::)
<-QUOTE}

Agreed.

And as anvil mentioned, AVK (and KAV Lite) are good alternatives--having the KAV engine included. PCC's not a slouch av, though. ;)

[stranger]

they say NAV is a trojan coders best friend; a server doesn't take much modifying to elude and slip pass NAVs detection. Let's just say Norton is not considered in the advance category among avs in trojan development circles. :)

[illukka]

one difference between nav and pc-cillin springs to mind.. Support!!
nav support is zilch, it sucks to say the least, whereas with trend micro the support is very good, at least here in finland..

[illukka]

about trojans, norton has been adding vast amounts of trojan signatures lately.. the lack of unpackers mean that they will have to make another sig for each packed variant, but they are doing it.

[Tassie_Devils]

Hello Hobnob...

I am with JimIT here. I've used PC-Cillin as my primary AV for my previous 3 systems. The ONLY time I ever had trouble was with a new engine update once [18 months ago], but I tried again a couple of days later it it went smooth.

Versions used were 2000, 2002, and now 2003. 2003 is by far the best yet.

It's: Fast; Updates regularly [sometimes twice a day when really bad nasties are found]; VERY EASY to use, the GUI is self explanatory. I have tested several over the course, but always found PCC [for ME] was the best way to go.

I have never had an infection at all [apart from the usual "nuisance" malware which AdAware and SpybotS&D removes anyway] since I've had PCC, but I use a well defined "layered" approach to security.

An AV ALONE does not make for 'top' security. You need other programs to cover all bases.

Some Points:

1: First, you MUST distinguish between Virus/Trojan.

All the AV's out there have a PRIMARY function of detecting viruses. That's been their main aim since Uncle Bill gave us Windows. :)

Even though some AV's have a very good detection rate of Trojans, it is extremely wise to get a dedicated Anti-Trojan program as well.

No matter HOW GOOD "your" AV may be, it will NEVER detect all possible infections. That's just plain fact. So an AT like TDS3 [which I use] from Diamond Computer Systems or Trojan Hunter [heard it is good, have not tried it] would be the way to go.

2: Someone mentioned that Unpackers are not good in PCC. Correct, but for a Trojan to execute, it must first be unpacked anyway. Although I would personally prefer them to be detected and wiped out straight up. BUT that's what the AT's come in handy for.

3: I used GAV [now discontinued] as a back-up and it's unpacking abilities were second to none. We used to download Test files from Gladiator [GAV] to test it's abilities with.

I used to do a scan with GAV but left PCC and Real Time Monitor running, and when GAV reached the folder and unpacked a trojan [these were real, but had been slightly modified so not to cause harm], PCC's RTM was the FIRST to jump all over the file. It grabbed it and quarantined it very quickly, so therefore I was pleased with PCC's performance.

Only you can be the best "guide" as to what program you eventually decide on. You have already stated you used and liked PCC for its ease, etc. so in part that's half the battle. You've used it, you liked it and regardless of which AV you pick, it will not detect 100% ALL of the time. But I will settle for 99% + a good AT.

4: Support. Well, that's a no brainer. Trend has been recognised as a great team for support. NAV users of course will also atest to it's support regime, but the number of complaints I have seen in a lot of forums leaves me gobsmacked with some of the stories. I only read a post 10 minutes ago complaining about it. However, this is in NO WAY meant to start a flaming war. Just from what I have seen. I have not seen 1 single post referring to Trend's lack of support yet, not to say they aren't out there, but not to my knowledge.

5: Go with your "gut" feeling. That's it. A lot of people have an 'instinct' and act on it. If you "feel" something is really right, go for it.

Best of luck mate.
Cheers, TAS.

[illukka]

tassie, you took the words from my mouth..
any top av will protect your pc well, be pc-cillin or nav or nod or anything. and for the price of KAV personal pro( the ultimate av)you can get pc-cillin and trojan hunter and be as well protected..
if you encounter any problems with pc-cillin, you will be helped by their support.. trying to get nav support is another story... spoken with broken english... best nav support for me has been other users at different forums
i have used both, seems i have at least trialled all av's out there.. if you find any new let me know ;)

[Tassie_Devils]

Hi Illukka.
:D

{QUOTE-> have used both, seems i have at least trialled all av's out there.. if you find any new let me know <-QUOTE}

LOL, well mate I do know of another new one, it's called "SBI" [Still Being Invented].... sorry, tongue in cheek.....but you are right, third party support is lousy at the best. Each person though, has to find their own comfort zone and work within that, as trying to use a product that they have trouble with, then get frustrated and annoyed with, will in the end cause distress and no matter how simple the "fix" may have been, it won't do the end user any good, they will simply switch.

Cheers, TAS

[_anvil]

@Tassie_Devils

{QUOTE-> 2: Someone mentioned that Unpackers are not good in PCC. Correct, but for a Trojan to execute, it must first be unpacked anyway. <-QUOTE}

Yes, but as we are talking about runtime-packers and cypters, the packed trojan is unpacked in RAM - and since PCC has no memory scanner, it will definitely not detect a packed trojan at _any_ state.
Neither before it executes, nor after the execution. :P

'Real' memory scanners are very rare, btw... although some AVs pretend to have one... ::)

[illukka]

it will detect if it has a signature for the packed trojan, like norton.. but each packed variant be it aspacked pecompressed or upx packed or anything needs a different signature.. but if the sigs are ok it_will_be_detected

[_anvil]

Yes, you are right... every AV has signatures of packed malware, so PCC and Norton will detect _a few_ packed trojans, too. :)

But of course, it is impossible to add as much 'packed' signatures as an unpacking engine would cover.
You can only detect a _minimal_ ammount of packed trojans by signatures compared to the _possible_ ammount of packed variants... that's why it's definitely no satisfactory solution... ::)

[Graystoke]

Hello everyone. This has been very interesting for me. I am learning some things I didn't know. Thanks to all of you for that.

I think I will trial one more AV before I make my decision. I'm going to give McAfee VS7(don't laugh) a try. I'm still leaning towards PCC, but want to try McAfee out.

Just a little side bar. I don't want to bash NAV. It has served me well for three years. I just don't understand why NAV doesn't update their virus defs everyday like most of the top AVs do. Instead they just do it once a week. I know you can download them from their Intelligent Updater, but that's an extra step I feel I shouldn't have to do. JMHO. :)

[JimIT]

{QUOTE-> quoting: Hobnob link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=15#msg70172 date=1056825394] I'm going to give McAfee VS7(don't laugh) a try. I'm still leaning towards PCC, but want to try McAfee out. <-QUOTE}

I don't think anyone here will laugh. ;)

Mac is a pretty darn good av...!

[Madsen DK]

Hobnob.
You was worried that NAV only updates once a week or so.
The same goes for Mcafee.
They do have daily dats, but they are a little tricky to use, for me anyway. ;D
If something serious happens, both vendors will provide extra updates, so the once in a week " in peacetime" shouldnt worry you.
And as Jim IT said, no one laughs.
McAfee is an excellent AV.
Regards
Ole :)

[Graystoke]

Hello all. Well I did my trial of McAfee VS7. It was ok, but I didn't feel comfortable with it. So I am still leaning towards a change to PCC.

{QUOTE-> quoting: _anvil link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=15#msg70104 date=1056799007]
@Tassie_Devils

{QUOTE-> 2: Someone mentioned that Unpackers are not good in PCC. Correct, but for a Trojan to execute, it must first be unpacked anyway. <-QUOTE}

Yes, but as we are talking about runtime-packers and cypters, the packed trojan is unpacked in RAM - and since PCC has no memory scanner, it will definitely not detect a packed trojan at _any_ state.
Neither before it executes, nor after the execution. :P

'Real' memory scanners are very rare, btw... although some AVs pretend to have one... ::)
<-QUOTE}


Does NAV have a "Real" memory scanner or is it a pretender?

[_anvil]

NAV has no real memory scanner (I don't know if it pretends to have one... ;) )

At the moment, I'm only aware of a few _ATs_ with proper memory scanner: TDS-3, Trojan Hunter, Boclean (sorry, if I forgot one)

[Graystoke]

Thanks anvil. :) I've decided to give one more AV a try. ::) I'm going to trial KAV lite. I've heard good things about it, so I thought I would give it a try. I'll probably install it later on today.

[Markus]

Hi,

if you like a scanner which offers daily updates an a very, very good engine, so take Kaspersky (Lite or Personal).

But: While testing, never run several AntiVirus tools at the same time, cause it will at least slow down you system!

Regards,
Markus

[Graystoke]

Hi Markus. Yep, I do only run one AV at a time. ;) It's sort of a hassle uninstalling and installing but it's the only way to do it. :)

[Graystoke]

Hi everyone. Just want to do an update. Not sure if anyone is really interested but.............

I know I have been all over the place here, but decided to post in this thread because this is where I started. I think. ???

After trying out a few AVs and asking questions I have come to a decission on a AV. I am going with PC-cillin 2003. Although it had a lot to do with what I felt comfortable with, I also kept going back to JimIT and Tassie_Devils' responses. They helped me out a great deal and I thank them.

So that's it. The quest is over. :D

Thanks to everyone else who added there suggestions and knowledge.

[Acadia]

In my opinion Pc-Cillin is a VERY decent antivirus. I am not currently using it but would have no problems using it if I had to. I used Pc-Cillin in the past but left it, not because of the product itself, but because of the company. My system has only ever contracted three viruses and Pc-cillin nailed each one instantly. Also, I recently read an article somewhere on the Internet where they compared the major, better known antivirus, and Pc-cillin had by far the least impact on System Resources, in that area they really were number one. Good luck.

Acadia

[JimIT]

{QUOTE-> quoting: Hobnob link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=30#msg77014 date=1059720085]

After trying out a few AVs and asking questions I have come to a decission on a AV. I am going with PC-cillin 2003. Although it had a lot to do with what I felt comfortable with, I also kept going back to JimIT and Tassie_Devils' responses. They helped me out a great deal and I thank them.
<-QUOTE}

Hey, you're welcome!

I think you made a great choice!

[Tassie_Devils]

Hi Hobnob... Well you finally settled on an AV. ;D

Good going! At least you can say you tried some others and had a choice. :)

Now, the only thing left [if you already have not done so] is to get yourself a dedicated AT program, TDS, Trojan Hunter. Give those a trial [although with TDS you cannot get auto update, has to be manual, and "Execution Protection" option [Real Time Protection of each executable] is unavailable..... But plenty of tests, scanning abilities are available..

Here is a nice link for TDS3 [as stated previously, have not tried Trojan Hunter myself].

http://tds.diamondcs.com.au/ TDS3 Home Page.

and... here at Wilders is a nice TDS3 Configuration courtesy of FanJ!

http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=2871

Reviews: http://www.anti-trojan-software-reviews.com/

I had more, but am sure the TDS3 home page will have some reviews listed there.

EDIT: Found others on home page: http://www.vanish.org/security/trojans.htm

{QUOTE-> TDS was the only anti-trojan system deemed worthy of a mention in the International best-seller "Hacking Exposed 2nd Edition" <-QUOTE}

also: http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~ehowes/trojans/tr-tests.htm



Cheers, TAS... :)

[Graystoke]

Hi Tassie_Devils. I had it down to three ATs. TrojanHunter which I've trialed and TDS3 and BOClean. Since there is no trial version of BOClean, I will give TDS3 a try first. Thanks for the links.

Again, thanks for all the help. :D

[Mele20]

I have PCCillin 2003 and I really liked it too until about two weeks ago when I and several others discovered a VERY irritating bug which Trend Micro has confirmed. I spent over an hour on the phone, on July 23, with an engineer discussing it. The really irritating thing was that I had this problem for two months and was tearing my hair out trying to figure out what was causing it and I never thought it could be my av until I happened on a post at DSLR where the poster commented that he had to get rid of PCC recently because of the very problem I was having! So, I then Googled and found another person who happened to be the first person to report the bug to Trend Micro a few weeks ago. Trend, at first, laughed at both these persons and denied that PCC was the cause.

The bug is in tmproxy.exe. This is new in the 2003 version along with WebTrap. After a certain number of hours without a reboot, tmproxy becomes corrupted somehow and you begin to get not only 400, 404, 501, etc. errors in your browser but you get sent to strange websites, rather than the one you requested and graphics become corrupted also. I was frequently getting a Microsoft POP3 email server which would complain loudly that I had not entered the proper commands within the time limit! Huh? I was mystified by these errors. I even got internal errors at websites when I would click on a new thread in a forum I would instead get Google although dslreports would be in the address bar! Weird stuff like that. Sometimes rapid clicking would get me to the right site, but eventually the errors would be constant and I would be forced to reboot and then the errors would be gone for a number hours and then they would start again. I got so many apache servers complaining that I, as the admin, (huh? I'm not an admin at any of these sites!) had not entered the proper commands that i was getting sick of it all and was really worried about my computer! I had called my ISP and Dell and they were mystified. I had searched for viruses but found none and was getting desperate when I finally learned what was causing this awful problem.

Trend Micro immediately acknowledged the problem when I called them thanks to the perserverance of the person I found by Googling who had the problem. The engineer told me that tmproxy.exe should be disabled in MSCONFIG startup and the file should be renamed so that it cannot run even after virus pattern updates. You can also remove it from the registry for good measure. The engineer said that when a patch is made that we would be notified by email. I got the impression though that Trend may not patch this because version 2004 will be in beta soon and they may wait to fix it in 2004 version.

You don't really need tmproxy.exe. It is used for scanning webmail accounts so if you don't have any of those then no problem in disabling. Even if you do, and I do, you can just rely on the resident scanner to catch any nasties. I don't use anything but the resident scanner in an av anyway. Had I realized exactly what tmproxy.exe was for I would have disabled it long ago out of principle as I never needed it as I feel an av's resident scanner is sufficient.
(I have always had the email scanner disabled and the registry key removed because PCC email scanner cannot be used with Road Runner and many other ISP's).


Edited to say that the Trend engineer told me (after I requested several times that he do this) that this bug, and the temporary workaround, will be posted on the Trend site because anyone who doesn't reboot (or shut down) often will be affected by the bug, but I haven't seen it posted there yet.

[Graystoke]

Oh man this is not what I wanted to hear. My PCC 2003 CD is due to arrive Tue., Aug 5th.

I ran the trial version for awhile and didn't notice any of the problems that you described. Don't know what OS you are running, but mine is XP Home. Don't know if that would make a difference.

Geeez, I'm gonna be really upset if I start having problems after putting down the $$ for PCC. I really liked eveything about it while using the trial version.

I've decided not to even think about it. Everyone else here seems to think it is a very good A/V. It was highly recommended. I'm gonna go with that.

[Mele20]

I'm sorry! But I thought you needed to know. The woman who is credited with discovering this bug has XP. The poster at DSLR who reported it to Trend about the same time but who wasn't persistent like she was in getting Trend to look into it has W98SE. She was under the impression that part of the problem was a conflict between Zone Alarm and PCC 2003. She has used PCC for many years and never had a problem until this mess. I'm reasonably sure (and so was the engineer that I spoke with) that ZA has nothing to do with this because I don't have ZA or any firewall...but then maybe it is problem with only one version of ZA conflicting with PCC on XP but not W98SE. The engineer said they have had reports from users of all OSes with this problem, but obviously not everyone using PCC has the problem. Trend is trying to isolate why some users have the problem and others don't. (Of course those moderate to heavy users who reboot at least once a day or more or those who use the computer lightly during a 24 hour period before reboot won't have the problem anyhow).

I also have a license for NOD32 which I had stopped using when I was beta testing it because I found a nasty bug in it and I had started using PCC and been using it for around six months. I didn't have this problem until about two months...maybe three... ago. It was shortly after an engine upgrade by Trend for W98 users that I started having the problem. XP users didn't get an upgrade though yet this woman has XP. So, I think perhaps that Trend updated tm.proxy for all OSes and that is the cause otherwise we should have all had this problem from time we got PCC 2003 and we haven't.

Anyhow, back to what I wanted to say about NOD32. Rather than do the workaround for PCC, I decided to try the release version of NOD32 and I've been using it for about 2 weeks now and what a relief! Not a single browser error, not a single corrupted graphic and and not a single strange web page! I usually reboot before I go to bed and now I can go that long or much, much longer if I want without all those weird problems. I really hated having to reboot when I had several instances of Ping Plotter running gathering data and a lot of tabs open on Mozilla. That was a real pain in the butt.

To look on the bright side, if you don't mind rebooting often I noticed the amount of time elapsing before the corruption affected browsing varied. It depended directly on how much I used the computer that day so it is something to do with the tmproxy screwing up DNS which apparantly is cached in the proxy and the longer you go without a reboot the more corrupted the cache becomes. Rebooting clears the cache and solves the problem...for awhile. Of course, with XP one advantage to it over W98SE is that you don't have to reboot very often so I doubt you are very enthusiastic about needing to reboot your XP like it is an unstable W98 or ME system.

You know, Trend is very nice and phone support is good although the quality varies from engineer to engineer. Maybe you will be lucky and won't be affected or maybe somehow the corruption comes after you have used the software for several months...if so, then Trend would have a permanent fix by the time it would bother you. I'm sure Trend will refund your money if you want. Or if it happens to you, you can apply the workaround as you really don't need tmproxy.exe. You will still be able to use the POP3 scanner (my not using the POP3 scanner is not because of this problem but for other reasons). So, even if this affects you...it's not that awful....especially since you know now what to expect. The worst part was trying to figure out what was causing these errors.

[Graystoke]

Thanks for all the information Mele20. I do appreciate it. I didn't mean to sound ungrateful in my last post. It was pretty late here when I read your post and wrote mine. I think I was getting a little rummy by that time. When I read your post about the problems with PCC, I thought oh no I screwed up. I was more upset with myself than anything esle. I kept thinking I should have done more research.

I've been trialing a few A/Vs, Extendia AVK, Panda Platinum, PCC and KAV. Nothing technical on my part. I just wanted something I felt comfortable with, worked smoothly on my computer and had good virus detection. I never tried NOD32. Maybe I should have. It came down to Extendia AVK and PCC 2003. I decided to go with PCC because of what I heard about their tech support. Believe me, Extendia AVK's tech support (Boomerang) is very bad.

Oh well, I ordered PCC through Amazon.com and they offered a $25 rebate. So if it doesn't work out, I'm not out that much.

Thanks again Mele20 for the information.

[Mele20]

That's ok. I too would be upset if I heard something like this right after I had bought the product. :)

I think you hit the nail on the head though about tech support. I left NAV (after two years of being very happy with NAV2001) because Symantec moved the tech support to India (both online and paid phone) and it became terrible. I gather Symantec provides very little training. Plus, there is the language problem as the accents are rather heavy (if you have phone support) and hard to understand and web support is poor partly because they don't understand slang and idiomatic usage of English and have trouble expressing themselves just using the language in ordinary ways.

I think Trend's free phone support (in the US and Canada) is the best support of all av vendors. The support is out of California which is even better. I really don't see how they can afford to do it. Of course, the renewal fee each year is higher than that of many av so maybe that is how they can afford free phone support.

I will probably use PCC again even if I have to do the round about fix and the reasons will be because the PCC GUI is the best I've seen (except for NAV) and because of the phone support. Plus, for me on W98SE, PCC is among the lowest on resource usage. I was also impressed when this engineer asked me what security sites I frequent. I told him my home site (DSLR) and he said that Trend would start monitoring there. They have had no official representation there whereas Symantec has 6 employees that monitor. Perhaps, in the future they will monitor here too. So, I do think that even with this yucky bug that you made a good choice.

[Graystoke]

Well I received my PCC CD today. I installed it but I can't register it. When I click on the Register Now button, a window opens asking me for my "old license key". I don't have an old license key. I don't have any license key. I have the serial #. As a matter of fact I have two. Both start with for letters and have 16 numbers. I can't figure out what the problem is. The instructions say if the license key doesn't appear on the Register Now screen I should copy it for the Web page. What web page? This if very frustrating.

[JimIT]

{QUOTE-> quoting: Hobnob link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=30#msg77785 date=1060068450]
Well I received my PCC CD today. I installed it but I can't register it. When I click on the Register Now button, a window opens asking me for my "old license key". I don't have an old license key. I don't have any license key. I have the serial #. As a matter of fact I have two. Both start with for letters and have 16 numbers. I can't figure out what the problem is. The instructions say if the license key doesn't appear on the Register Now screen I should copy it for the Web page. What web page? This if very frustrating.
<-QUOTE}

Hobnob,

I haven't had this problem, but Trend can help you with this. The license key should appear on the web page presented from Trend after you hit the Register Now button. If it doesn't, they can probably e-mail it to you.

At any rate, I would definitely e-mail Trend for help.

Keep us posted. ;)

[Graystoke]

JimIT

First let me say that I purchased this PCC 2003 CD from Amazon.com. They had a good deal with a rebate. Maybe not worth it. :( We will see.

I contacted Trend Mirco tech support by phone. I was told that the serial # that was with the CD is registered to someone else. Can you believe that! >:( Trend Micro couldn't issue a new serial # because I purchased PCC from Amazon.

I contacted Amazon's customer service. She was very nice. Said she never heard of anything like this happening before. Do I believe her? :-\ They will ship out a replacement CD, one day air at no charge. Hopefully this one will not be registered to someone else.

[Mele20]

Wow! That is some tale. I've been leery of buying at Amazon now I will be even more so. Nice though that she is sending it by overnight air at no extra charge. Let's hope it is ok.

[dom424]

We use amazon.com all the time and have never had 1 problem. Reckon I better knock on wood.

I have PC cillin 2003 on XP Pro and 2k Pro and have had good experiances there too.

[Graystoke]

It is some kind of story isn't it? This was my first experience with Amazon.com. It's not a confidence builder that for sure. Hopefully things will be straightened out and I can enjoy my PCC.

You are right. Trend Micro has great tech support. They were very helpful over the phone. And no long wait on hold. :D

I will keep everyone updated on what happens.

Hi dom424. I wrote the above before I saw your post. It's nice to hear you've had a good experience with Amazon.com. Hopefully this was just a fluke. They did seem sincere when apologizing for the inconvenience they caused.

[Blackcat]

Hey Hobnob

Are you sure they did not send you one of their USED copies of PCC they had lying about?

Never heard of this situation before.

Keep us all posted.

[Mele20]

>You are right. Trend Micro has great tech support. They were very helpful over the phone. And no long wait on hold.

How could I have forgotten to mention there is never a long wait on hold?! That is amazing especially when all tech support (not just av support) is getting worse and there are longer and longer holds....here is Trend Micro and someone answers your call very quickly and the support is free. Amazing. Glad you found the support great too.

Another thing about Trend Micro tech support. They are very thorough and courteous to a fault. If you need walking through something like how to delete a registry key because you are nervous wnen in the registry, Trend will happily stay on the phone and walk you through it. It is amazing. Dell used to have free phone tech support like that but no more. Same with Symantec and others including Microsoft. Trend Micro is going against the trend and I bet it gets them a lot more users.

[Graystoke]

{QUOTE-> Hey Hobnob

Are you sure they did not send you one of their USED copies of PCC they had lying about?

Never heard of this situation before. <-QUOTE}

Good question. I was wondering the same thing after the second uninstall/re-install. I kept thinking why two serial numbers. But then I kept saying to myself the folder the CD and instruction guide came in was sealed. Now that I think about it Amazon could have put the seal on. All it says is that the CD is subject to the terms of the license agreement. And since Trend Micro says it is registered to someone else, I'm almost positive it is used.




{QUOTE-> How could I have forgotten to mention there is never a long wait on hold?! That is amazing especially when all tech support (not just av support) is getting worse and there are longer and longer holds....here is Trend Micro and someone answers your call very quickly and the support is free. Amazing. Glad you found the support great too <-QUOTE}


It is refreshing. I was pleasantly surprised. I've always heard that they had great support, now I believe it. I can't wait to get this mess straightened out with Amazon so I can fully enjoy my PCC without all the distractions.

[Graystoke]

I received my replacement PCC 2003 CD from Amazon.com today. I installed it and clicked on the Register Now button. I am happy to say I am now a registered owner of PCC 2003. :D

After all the help I have received here, I do have one more question.

In Manual Scan I have it set to scan All Files. I left the Compression Layers and the default 5. In the Real Time Scan I have it set at the defaults for now (Recommended Files and Compression Layers at 1). Do you recommend I have All Files and a higher Compression Layers set in the Real Time Scan?

[LDM]

I know this is rather late, but I just found this forum. I use a av by the name of AVG. It is VERY good and works well with email. One fantastic part of thre program is that it is FREE. Thats right, free and the updates are free. I have been using this program for about three years now and it has saved my system many times. They have a network version as well as a stand alone. The updates are done automatically at your preset times. www.grisoft.com.

[Blackcat]

Welcolm to wilders, LDM

Your post was a little off the main thread, so you could have started a new one with your thoughts on AVG.

If you have no AV installed and no money, AVG is a good choice and many people use this product.

However, if you take the time to read through some of the past posts here( try the search button) you will find that there are FREE alternatives to AVG- Avast, BitDefender and Etrust7 Server edition that offer as good/possibly even better protection.

If you are happy with your present choice I would suggest using one of these other free AV programs or the occasional use of an on-line AV scanner as BACKUP to AVG.

However, if you are on 24/7 a commercial AV program would probably offer you better protection than AVG. As with a lot of things 'You get what you pay for'.

[JimIT]

{QUOTE-> quoting: Hobnob link=board=24;threadid=10758;start=45#msg78337 date=1060293129]
I received my replacement PCC 2003 CD from Amazon.com today. I installed it and clicked on the Register Now button. I am happy to say I am now a registered owner of PCC 2003. :D
<-QUOTE}

Great! Welcome to the fold! ;D

{QUOTE->
After all the help I have received here, I do have one more question.

In Manual Scan I have it set to scan All Files. I left the Compression Layers and the default 5. In the Real Time Scan I have it set at the defaults for now (Recommended Files and Compression Layers at 1). Do you recommend I have All Files and a higher Compression Layers set in the Real Time Scan?
<-QUOTE}

I leave this setting at defaults except for the compression layers, which I have set to 5. It's a matter of preference and system performance hit, although I don't think you'll see any drag running it set higher.

Personally, I think your settings are fine, but experiment a little.

Glad Trend got you fixed up! ;)

[Graystoke]

Thanks JimIT. :)